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  • Karl, yuh see this...Robotham article

    Time to defeat the lumpen - Why were they left out of Senate appointments?
    published: Sunday | September 30, 2007

    Don Robotham, Contributor


    Morris, Mottley and Munroe


    The back and forth around the two seats in Hanover and St. Mary and the court cases brought around dual citizenship have stimulated public concern. The fact that only 59 MPs were available to be sworn in for the opening of Parliament speaks volumes.

    At its core this is a political not a constitutional problem. The political problem is this: PNP zealots refuse to accept that the JLP has won the elections. The problem is the influence of the lumpen over the political leadership of the PNP. The problem also is this - some well-known PNP personalities from the middle class are encouraging this destructiveness.

    Over a period of 18 years, a lumpen army, large and small, has come to be dependent on the state for contracts, board appointments, jobs, security protection, insider information, contacts and privileges. Retaining control over the state is a matter of life and death for them. They cannot give it up just because of a vote. They must fight to the finish with whatever means necessary.

    This is the real reason for the court cases on dual citizenship. They are one tactic in a secret war that this lumpen army is waging. The absurd PNP appointments to the Senate are a second tactic: they are a further reflection of the persistence of this destructive mentality. The appointment of K.D. Knight, Basil Waite and Mark Golding is a transparent attempt to obscure reality. When persons such as Floyd Morris, Donna Scott-Mottley and Trevor Munroe are summarily discarded and replaced by bridesmaids, the message is loud and clear. The lumpen are in command.

    JUDICIAL STRATAGEMS

    Further, an intention has been declared not to bother to appoint a Shadow Cabinet. This will be the third tactic of the lumpen. The point of this one is to weaken that part of the PNP which supports Peter Phillips and Maxine Henry-Wilson.

    For the moment, the PNP is cooing that if they win in the courts, they will be magnanimous. Out of the goodness of their hearts, they say, they will not push to recover power for themselves. Instead they would go for fresh elections. A promise is a comfort to a fool. That is the song being sung now by naive PNP legal luminaries who have to justify their pusillanimity to themselves. But what is the song which will be sung later, if the PNP actually wins in the courts? We must understand the games which the lumpen are playing and deal with them pre-emptively.

    We must make it clear to the lumpen hard core and their opportunistic supporters in the middle class, that no matter what the outcome in the courts, they will not be allowed to re-take power by backdoor judicial means. This is the fundamental point to maintain at all times.

    For consider the political consequences of pursuing the judicial challenges. If, for example the PNP were to succeed in unseating Shahine Robinson, Daryl Vaz or Gregory Mair then the people of St. Ann north-eastern, Portland western and St. Catherine north-eastern would have been disenfranchised by a legalistic manoeuvre. How would these 23,533 persons who voted JLP and the entire JLP mass base react? They must take to the streets and vigorously too. There will be counter-mobilisations on the PNP side. Very severe social and political instability could ensue.

    LEGAL CHALLENGES

    What happens if the legal challenges result in a 30-30 draw? What legal rights does the Governor General possess to intervene? Will the old government simply continue, even though, with the Speaker excluded, they would in fact be in the minority? How will it be determined who has 'the confidence' of a majority of the House?

    No one has been able to offer convincing answers to such questions. If, for example, the Governor General were to rely on the majority vote and on this basis confirm Mr. Golding as Prime Minister, enormous legal and political consequences could follow. It would drag the Governor General into the arena of partisan political contestation for the first time in our modern history. This has the potential to shake the legitimacy of our political system to its very foundations.

    This is where lumpen intransigence mixed with legalistic hypocrisy and blind egoism threatens to drag us. They are bent on bringing down the whole house on our heads if necessary to keep power.

    POLITICAL SOLUTION

    The key to finding a solution is to approach the problem politically, not just judicially.

    The first thing is for Mr. Golding to strengthen himself with the political centre. His Senate appointment of Mrs. Hyacinth Bennett is an excellent start but more is needed. He must intensify his efforts to retain highly respected PNP professionals who are willing to work with the Government. They must be made to understand that their services are valued and that the new government genuinely welcomes them on board.

    The moves to eliminate transfer taxes and to resolve delays in the plan approval process are heading in the right direction. The effort to address police brutality - a very difficult matter - must be continued. Mr. Golding must persist with his moderate and statesmanlike tone. Above all, he must take up the youth question seriously, as I have been advocating repeatedly. This can be done initially without necessarily placing a huge additional charge on the budget.

    The point of all of this is to strengthen the new government in the middle ground and to isolate the PNP lumpen and their middle class supporters in their small noisy corner. JLP supporters must show understanding of these realities and stop crowding Mr. Golding. He needs more room to manoeuvre.

    The more the PNP lumpen are isolated, the less their judicial games matter. Fight them hard in the courts but defeat them politically. What will they be able to do with this so-called victory in a political climate which is overwhelmingly hostile to them? Not one thing!

    Once Mr. Golding begins to accumulate political forces from the centre on his side, then the game is up for the PNP lumpen and those 'hardears' members of the PNP middle class who opportunistically support them. Mr. Golding can now return to the polls with confidence and beat the lumpen and their backers into submission twice!

    This is not just a matter of local government elections. He has to think more broadly. He may have to either call fresh general elections or have a series of by-elections in the affected constituencies. The PNP is broke, disunited and cannot fight fresh elections of any kind. They will be wiped out. The fresh elections may have to be sooner than either Mr. Golding or the nation may wish. But the country should support him in this endeavour. It is a small price to pay to defeat the lumpen leadership of the PNP once and for all.

    The road to social stability is a political road. The sensible elements in the PNP are unable or unwilling to subordinate the lumpen. So the country has to do it for them. It is not that there are no lumpen in the JLP because they are many. The crucial difference however is this: the lumpen do not control the JLP leadership.

    One of the awful heritages of the Patterson years is the decay of the PNP. It is a shadow of its former self, scorning its tradition of positive social development and in the grip of the lumpen. As the PNP presidential elections proved, the lumpen cleverly exploit the ambitions of some members of the PNP middle class in order to divide and rule.

    No country can progress under the leadership of the lumpen. Decades of economic stagnation has meant that these social strata have become a pervasive force in our political, economic and cultural life. Their nefarious influence is the crux of our values and attitudes problem. They are the reason why our corruption rating has fallen some 23 places in a single year which must be a world record! We have to defeat the lumpen politically, economically, socially and culturally, in whichever space they rear their heads. Some elements in the PNP middle class are playing footsie with them. Mr. Golding has to fix this, for the good of the PNP, and of Jamaica.

  • #2
    WOW!!!!!
    • Don't let negative things break you, instead let it be your strength, your reason for growth. Life is for living and I won't spend my life feeling cheated and downtrodden.

    Comment


    • #3
      Oh ok, at least I can shorten 'part of the problem' to lumpen.. makes it easier for me.

      some ah unnuh need fi abandon yuh lumpen ways...

      Comment


      • #4
        This will play well with those disaffected with the PNP...but, it is not an honest look at the reality of our situation.

        Suffice it to say, Bruce of necessity must try to shore up his 'vote count'...so policies and programs aimed at winning more seats to his JLP is on.

        Bruce will (i.e. both his reading...and, he will be forced to..will=MUS & BOUND) call elections before his term expires as he seeks to have more breathing space by increasing JLP MP votes in the House.

        This also means if the PNP is to make short-term advances - as I alluded to immediately after the elections - must ciontinue on in overdrive to unseat Bruce and his JLP. It all boils down to "the how". One thing not being in government does it frees up more time to spend - meeing the people!

        ...and, what does it mean for Jamaica - further polarisation and increased tensions? Not necessarily, as said earlier it all depends on "the how" each party goes about trying to win the people's minds and support.
        "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Karl View Post
          This will play well with those disaffected with the PNP...but, it is not an honest look at the reality of our situation.

          Suffice it to say, Bruce of necessity must try to shore up his 'vote count'...so policies and programs aimed at winning more seats to his JLP is on.

          Bruce will (i.e. both his reading...and, he will be forced to..will=MUS & BOUND) call elections before his term expires as he seeks to have more breathing space by increasing JLP MP votes in the House.

          This also means if the PNP is to make short-term advances - as I alluded to immediately after the elections - must ciontinue on in overdrive to unseat Bruce and his JLP. It all boils down to "the how". One thing not being in government does it frees up more time to spend - meeing the people!

          ...and, what does it mean for Jamaica - further polarisation and increased tensions? Not necessarily, as said earlier it all depends on "the how" each party goes about trying to win the people's minds and support.
          Yuh cyaan tell nuhbaddy seh dem baby pickney ugly..dem will seh a lie yuh ah tell..

          Heh, heh.

          Poor Karl.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Maudib View Post
            Yuh cyaan tell nuhbaddy seh dem baby pickney ugly..dem will seh a lie yuh ah tell..

            Heh, heh.

            Poor Karl.
            So is Bruce and the JLP in election mode or no?

            When are the parish council elections?

            ...and, will be Bruce be looking for his mandate in 18 months?
            "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."

            Comment


            • #7
              Robotham's social contempt
              published: Tuesday | October 2, 2007

              The Editor, Sir:
              Professor Don Robotham has written an uncharacteristic intemperate piece titled, 'Time to defeat the lumpen' (Sunday, September 30) in which he suggests that matter of the violation of the constitution in the dual [COLOR=orange ! important][COLOR=orange ! important]citizenship[/COLOR][/COLOR] affair is "at its core a political problem not a constitutional problem". He says that the political problem is this: "PNP zealots refuse to accept that the JLP has won the elections". He further suggests that it is a problem of the lumpen elements who have gained influence over the [COLOR=orange ! important][COLOR=orange ! important]leadership[/COLOR][/COLOR] of the PNP.
              The petulance and social contempt of the learned professor, writing as he does from the splendid distance of the metropolis, is to be rejected.
              Unfortunately, Professor Robotham has fallen prey to the temptation of those who live elsewhere of treating Jamaica as a banana republic, the laws of which do not matter, but are minor inconveniences to be got rid of or ignored at whim. Those who enter our Parliament must qualify to do so by a demonstrably and unchallengeable single-minded commitment to the national interest. The constitutional provision which insists only that those who have not, by their own action, pledged allegiance to a foreign power should be Members of the Parliament is not trivial.
              The intemperance and confusion of Professor Robotham's article was exceeded only by its contempt for the members of the under classes who constitute the majority of those who are members of both political parties. He calls them lumpen.
              I am, etc.,
              GARNETT ROPER
              Kingston
              Solidarity is not a matter of well wishing, but is sharing the very same fate whether in victory or in death.
              Che Guevara.

              Comment


              • #8
                Agreed 100%!


                BLACK LIVES MATTER

                Comment


                • #9
                  Garnett Roper????

                  What this man had to say about the law not being a shackle???

                  He is nothing but a die-hard hack. I read him in the Herald and I just have to laugh.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Willi View Post
                    Time to defeat the lumpen - Why were they left out of Senate appointments?
                    published: Sunday | September 30, 2007

                    Don Robotham, Contributor


                    At its core this is a political not a constitutional problem. The political problem is this: PNP zealots refuse to accept that the JLP has won the elections. The problem is the influence of the lumpen over the political leadership of the PNP. The problem also is this - some well-known PNP personalities from the middle class are encouraging this destructiveness.

                    Over a period of 18 years, a lumpen army, large and small, has come to be dependent on the state for contracts, board appointments, jobs, security protection, insider information, contacts and privileges. Retaining control over the state is a matter of life and death for them. They cannot give it up just because of a vote. They must fight to the finish with whatever means necessary.

                    This is the real reason for the court cases on dual citizenship. They are one tactic in a secret war that this lumpen army is waging. The absurd PNP appointments to the Senate are a second tactic: they are a further reflection of the persistence of this destructive mentality. The appointment of K.D. Knight, Basil Waite and Mark Golding is a transparent attempt to obscure reality. When persons such as Floyd Morris, Donna Scott-Mottley and Trevor Munroe are summarily discarded and replaced by bridesmaids, the message is loud and clear. The lumpen are in command.

                    Five election-voiding petitions rejected
                    published: Tuesday | October 2, 2007

                    JOAN GORDON Webley, Sally Porteous and Dr. D.K. Duncan are among five candidates who had their petition for the voiding of polls in their constituencies in the September 3 election dismissed by the Constituted Authority.

                    A news release, which appeared under the name of Justice R.G. Langrin, chairman of the Constituted Authority, says the candidates who appealed to the body for the voiding of the polls did not convince the authority that an application must be made to the Election Court for such ruling.
                    Under Section 37 of the Election Petitions Act, the Constituted Authority may apply to the election court for the voiding of the taking of the poll.

                    Violence cited
                    Mrs. Gordon-Webley, representing the Jamaica labour Party (JLP), lost the South East St. Andrew seat to the People's National Party's (PNP) Maxine Henry-Wilson. Ms. Porteous, JLP, lost the Central Manchester seat to Peter Bunting, PNP.

                    Most of the candidates who applied claimed that there was an upsurge in violence on election day in one or more polling stations or polling divisions or in any electoral division or constituency which would lead to a substantial distortion or subversion of the process of free and fair election.

                    Dr. D.K. Duncan, PNP, who is in an intense battle to win the Eastern Hanover seat from the JLP's Barrington Gray, is one of two PNP candidates to have had his application disqualified. The other is Patrick Roberts, who lost the West Central St. Andrew seat to Andrew Holness.
                    Neither of these candidates submitted evidence to substantiate their claim, as required by law.

                    Unsubstantiated claims
                    Joel Williams, the lone JLP candidate to lose in Clarendon, also had his application for the voiding of the polls in South West Clarendon dismissed as the Constituted Authority decided that his claims were largely unsubstantiated. He lost the seat to the PNP's Noel Arscott.

                    "Accordingly, the Constituted Authority did not, whether on its own motion or at the request of any of the candidates, determine that any application ought to be made to the election court with a view to voiding the taking of polls within a polling station, polling division or constituency," the release from the Constituted Authority says.
                    Grounds for voiding polls

                    That the total number of votes cast in a constituency or electoral division exceeds the number of electors on the official list for that constituency or electoral division.


                    That ballot boxes have been stolen or destroyed or have in any manner been tampered with and the number of electors on the list of electors for the polling stations is more than the difference in the number of votes cast for the candidate declared the winner and the candidate who is not declared the winner.


                    That a presiding officer has, under duress, signed ballots and that the number of ballots so signed is sufficient to cast doubt on the majority of votes counted for the candidate declared elected.


                    That votes have been polled by persons who are not bona fide electors, thereby casting doubt on the integrity of the votes counted for the candidate declared elected.

                    That there is an upsurge in violence or any irregularity during election day in one or more polling stations or polling divisions or in any electoral division or constituency, which would lead to a substantial distortion or subversion of the process of free and fair election."

                    ------- I guess the JLP persons trying to win here have not yet realised the JLP has won the elections are blinding trying to ensure that win...

                    ...hey Don: "The problem is the JLP lumpen over the leadership of the JLP"? Fits right into your crap?

                    Hey Don; Certainly if the PNP candidates attempts to use the courts to change election results...makes them "lumpen trying to trump leadership"...

                    ...then, JLP candidates doing the same must mean...JLP lumpen trying to trump JLP leadership? Right?




                    JUDICIAL STRATAGEMS

                    Further, an intention has been declared not to bother to appoint a Shadow Cabinet. This will be the third tactic of the lumpen. The point of this one is to weaken that part of the PNP which supports Peter Phillips and Maxine Henry-Wilson.
                    Yes! ...and, to underscore your knowing the PM appoints Perter Philips and Maxine Henry to her Shadow Cabinet?

                    [quote]
                    For the moment, the PNP is cooing that if they win in the courts, they will be magnanimous. Out of the goodness of their hearts, they say, they will not push to recover power for themselves. Instead they would go for fresh elections. A promise is a comfort to a fool. That is the song being sung now by naive PNP legal luminaries who have to justify their pusillanimity to themselves. But what is the song which will be sung later, if the PNP actually wins in the courts? We must understand the games which the lumpen are playing and deal with them pre-emptively.

                    We must make it clear to the lumpen hard core and their opportunistic supporters in the middle class, that no matter what the outcome in the courts, they will not be allowed to re-take power by backdoor judicial means. This is the fundamental point to maintain at all times.

                    For consider the political consequences of pursuing the judicial challenges. If, for example the PNP were to succeed in unseating Shahine Robinson, Daryl Vaz or Gregory Mair then the people of St. Ann north-eastern, Portland western and St. Catherine north-eastern would have been disenfranchised by a legalistic manoeuvre. How would these 23,533 persons who voted JLP and the entire JLP mass base react? They must take to the streets and vigorously too. There will be counter-mobilisations on the PNP side. Very severe social and political instability could ensue.

                    [/quote

                    So you are suggesting physical confrontations...and, heightened tensions? No let the courts and the other processes evolve and provide peaceful ways forward?

                    Mad man!


                    LEGAL CHALLENGES

                    What happens if the legal challenges result in a 30-30 draw? What legal rights does the Governor General possess to intervene? Will the old government simply continue, even though, with the Speaker excluded, they would in fact be in the minority? How will it be determined who has 'the confidence' of a majority of the House?

                    No one has been able to offer convincing answers to such questions. If, for example, the Governor General were to rely on the majority vote and on this basis confirm Mr. Golding as Prime Minister, enormous legal and political consequences could follow. It would drag the Governor General into the arena of partisan political contestation for the first time in our modern history. This has the potential to shake the legitimacy of our political system to its very foundations.

                    This is where lumpen intransigence mixed with legalistic hypocrisy and blind egoism threatens to drag us. They are bent on bringing down the whole house on our heads if necessary to keep power.
                    His very next paragraph - says there is NOT A PROBLEM!

                    POLITICAL SOLUTION

                    The key to finding a solution is to approach the problem politically, not just judicially.
                    Yes! ...NO PROBLEM!


                    The first thing is for Mr. Golding to strengthen himself with the political centre. His Senate appointment of Mrs. Hyacinth Bennett is an excellent start but more is needed. He must intensify his efforts to retain highly respected PNP professionals who are willing to work with the Government. They must be made to understand that their services are valued and that the new government genuinely welcomes them on board.
                    Can it be any other way?

                    NO!

                    Those who advocte firing of 'so-called PNP supporters and workers' are down right mad. At the very least some persons must have shifted from a vote for the PNP in former elections....and, there must have been others who shifted towards the PNP...besides we all are only "1 degree of separation" removed.

                    The call for witch hunts -is NONSENSE!


                    The moves to eliminate transfer taxes...
                    Will benefit some...but, it shall be "what the right hand gives, the left takes back". It cannot be any other way as I am insisting that the funds needs to address all our social and infrastructural needs is upwards of 300 billions of U$ dollars ...if the aim is to "fast forward" us to current first world status and allowing us the opportunity to march lock-step with and on advances of the first world countries.


                    ...and to resolve delays in the plan approval process are heading in the right direction. The effort to address police brutality - a very difficult matter - must be continued. Mr. Golding must persist with his moderate and statesmanlike tone. Above all, he must take up the youth question seriously, as I have been advocating repeatedly. This can be done initially without necessarily placing a huge additional charge on the budget.

                    The point of all of this is to strengthen the new government in the middle ground and to isolate the PNP lumpen and their middle class supporters in their small noisy corner. JLP supporters must show understanding of these realities and stop crowding Mr. Golding. He needs more room to manoeuvre.

                    The more the PNP lumpen are isolated, the less their judicial games matter. Fight them hard in the courts but defeat them politically. What will they be able to do with this so-called victory in a political climate which is overwhelmingly hostile to them? Not one thing!

                    Once Mr. Golding begins to accumulate political forces from the centre on his side, then the game is up for the PNP lumpen and those 'hardears' members of the PNP middle class who opportunistically support them. Mr. Golding can now return to the polls with confidence and beat the lumpen and their backers into submission twice!

                    This is not just a matter of local government elections. He has to think more broadly. He may have to either call fresh general elections or have a series of by-elections in the affected constituencies. The PNP is broke, disunited and cannot fight fresh elections of any kind. They will be wiped out. The fresh elections may have to be sooner than either Mr. Golding or the nation may wish. But the country should support him in this endeavour. It is a small price to pay to defeat the lumpen leadership of the PNP once and for all.

                    The road to social stability is a political road. The sensible elements in the PNP are unable or unwilling to subordinate the lumpen. So the country has to do it for them. It is not that there are no lumpen in the JLP because they are many. The crucial difference however is this: the lumpen do not control the JLP leadership.

                    One of the awful heritages of the Patterson years is the decay of the PNP. It is a shadow of its former self, scorning its tradition of positive social development and in the grip of the lumpen. As the PNP presidential elections proved, the lumpen cleverly exploit the ambitions of some members of the PNP middle class in order to divide and rule.

                    No country can progress under the leadership of the lumpen. Decades of economic stagnation has meant that these social strata have become a pervasive force in our political, economic and cultural life. Their nefarious influence is the crux of our values and attitudes problem. They are the reason why our corruption rating has fallen some 23 places in a single year which must be a world record! We have to defeat the lumpen politically, economically, socially and culturally, in whichever space they rear their heads. Some elements in the PNP middle class are playing footsie with them. Mr. Golding has to fix this, for the good of the PNP, and of Jamaica.

                    blaaa! blaaa! blaaaa!

                    Returning Jamaica to a more civil society is a must! ...and, taking advantage of that too long waiting on the cusp for rapid move towards first world status...that "poised for take off"...is on us!
                    FORWARD! ...and, we shall see, what we shall see!

                    Tired of the nonsense pretenses by the JLP supporters and there 'klans'...it is time for them to acknowledge their lies to the people - remain on course...no changing course from the PNP core values and plans...and, just "do it" or as in the extremely small JFF - where Boxhill and his JFF administration found out...it is "do" or "walk"!
                    "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Tired of the nonsense pretenses by the JLP supporters and there 'klans'...it is time for them to acknowledge their lies to the people - remain on course...no changing course from the PNP core values and plans...and, just "do it" or as in the extremely small JFF - where Boxhill and his JFF administration found out...it is "do" or "walk"!


                      JLP???
                      Robotham is an old socialist. He is PNP and is pushing his own preferred candidate! He is CAP!!!!!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sickko View Post
                        Robotham's social contempt
                        published: Tuesday | October 2, 2007

                        The Editor, Sir:
                        Professor Don Robotham has written an uncharacteristic intemperate piece titled, 'Time to defeat the lumpen' (Sunday, September 30) in which he suggests that matter of the violation of the constitution in the dual [COLOR=orange ! important][COLOR=orange ! important]citizenship[/COLOR][/COLOR] affair is "at its core a political problem not a constitutional problem". He says that the political problem is this: "PNP zealots refuse to accept that the JLP has won the elections". He further suggests that it is a problem of the lumpen elements who have gained influence over the [COLOR=orange ! important][COLOR=orange ! important]leadership[/COLOR][/COLOR] of the PNP.
                        The petulance and social contempt of the learned professor, writing as he does from the splendid distance of the metropolis, is to be rejected.
                        Unfortunately, Professor Robotham has fallen prey to the temptation of those who live elsewhere of treating Jamaica as a banana republic, the laws of which do not matter, but are minor inconveniences to be got rid of or ignored at whim. Those who enter our Parliament must qualify to do so by a demonstrably and unchallengeable single-minded commitment to the national interest. The constitutional provision which insists only that those who have not, by their own action, pledged allegiance to a foreign power should be Members of the Parliament is not trivial.
                        The intemperance and confusion of Professor Robotham's article was exceeded only by its contempt for the members of the under classes who constitute the majority of those who are members of both political parties. He calls them lumpen.
                        I am, etc.,
                        GARNETT ROPER
                        Kingston
                        The LUMPEN responds !

                        LOL !! WHOOOEE !!

                        Garnett Roper is a waste of space.

                        What chaotic forces produce these people ?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Yuh come back with this US$300 Billion dollar madness ?

                          BWAHHAAAA !!!

                          Straight mad man.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            That is over US$100,000 dollars for every man woman and child in Jamaica...

                            You sir are stark raving mad.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Willi View Post
                              Tired of the nonsense pretenses by the JLP supporters and there 'klans'...it is time for them to acknowledge their lies to the people - remain on course...no changing course from the PNP core values and plans...and, just "do it" or as in the extremely small JFF - where Boxhill and his JFF administration found out...it is "do" or "walk"!


                              JLP???
                              Robotham is an old socialist. He is PNP and is pushing his own preferred candidate! He is CAP!!!!!
                              You do not thing he is pushing a pro-JLP line?
                              OK...tell me his agenda?
                              "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."

                              Comment

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