Chinese spacecraft lands on moon

[Muadib]

The F-22 has been in operation for 10 years...

You are truly lost...

[Don1]

Yuh new to dis...and it shows yuteman

The F-22 is too expensive and is now outdated....Not worthy of upgrading per the Pentagon.. i.e. pretty much a failed program now scrapped at < 200 units...this is the reason ~2500 F-35s are planned to replace that expensive flop

Unfortunately the F-35 suffers critical design & manufacturing defects some of which are not fixable...and that plane, the most modern in the US fleet and which is in LRIP.... has been assessed as incapable of defeating even existing modernized SU-35 Flankers....and is seen as being sacrificial lambs for upcoming Sukhoi T-50s and Chinese JXX stealth fighters

You need to start paying me for your aerospace education yuteman ...wooooiiee

[Muadib]

in the meantime.. the Chinese 5th Generation mogel will not be operational for 'astute analysis' till almost 2020...

lol ! woiee !

You cannot be this obtuse... can you ?

[Don1]

The F-35 is in LRIP and battling multiple issues because of substandard design and the fact that they started manufacturing the plane BEFORE the many faults were even identified much less fixed (what in Pentagon-speak is called concurrency)... so even the LRIP units manufactured will undergo expensive retrofitting to make them moderately operational in a few years hence when fixes are certified for the overwhelming number of mission-critical faults

The JSF's issues MAY be sorted out in 3-4 years and a stable weapons platform created ~2017-2018... unfortunately the JXX still beats the F-35 in ALL cardinal parameters according to many experts including Dr Kopp of APA...

The fact that there is even this debate in 2013 between the relative merits of top end US and Chinese aircraft is telling...especially when many believe the US example is inferior. This situation is emerging from the 1980s when China could not produce a modern plane of ANY variety

Based on the technology trajectory this is a huge headache for the US military establishment especially since they're committed for the next 40 years to produce & operate ~2500 units of what may be an inferior platform

Here the lesson endeth... Go forth in peace and with your ignorance slightly reduced

[Muadib]

<Based on the technology trajectory this is a huge headache for the US military establishment especially since they're committed for the next 40 years to produce & operate ~2500 units of what may be an inferior platform>

May, woulda, coulda, iffa !

lol !.. wheh di fuss Chinese 5th Generation plane operational data deh tuh mek dis speculation relevant ??



You are an idiot if you really believe the USA will be concerned about 5th Generation plane operation 30 years from now.. much less 40 !

[Muadib]

Oh no.. confusion Down Under !

<In June 2012, Australia's Air Vice Marshal Osley responded to Air Power Australia's criticisms by saying "Air Power Australia (Kopp and Goon) claim that the F-35 will not be competitive in 2020 and that Air Power Australia's criticisms mainly center around F-35's aerodynamic performance and stealth capabilities." Osley continued with, "these are inconsistent with years of detailed analysis that has been undertaken by Defence, the JSF program office, Lockheed Martin, the U.S. services and the eight other partner nations. While aircraft developments such as the Russian PAK-FA or the Chinese J20, as argued by Airpower Australia, show that threats we could potentially face are becoming increasingly sophisticated, there is nothing new regarding development of these aircraft to change Defence's assessment." He then said that he thinks that the Air Power Australia's "analysis is basically flawed through incorrect assumptions and a lack of knowledge of the classified F-35 performance information.>

Speculation running rampant...

My advice to you nostridamus is to probably wait till di Chiney plane is operational.. den yuh can compare apples to apples.. right now yuh comparing apples to.. well.. nothing...

In di meantime, trust me when I tell you.. the World is NOT flat..

[Don1]

Yuteman yuh new to dis debate suh mi affi si wid yuh ... ah juss tuhdeh afta yuh intanet search yuh ah get a glimmer suh yuh still deh ah di bottom ah di learning curve

Mi nuh falla guy who ave vested interest in defending what could be a US$500Billion mistake...ah fi dem man job fi defen govt fcukups

Mi guh wid expert independent observers who don't have a stake in defending what is increasingly known in the industry as a flawed & inadequate product i.e. the JSF

But the point being made is really not which aircraft is superior... that is a matter of opinion to which people can differ....even yuh now dat yuh discover the debate on the aircraft....yuh late an' inadequate as usual

The larger point is that in the 1980s China was 30 years behind USA aerospace technology. Today that gap in many areas is less than 10 years...and in a few areas their technology is in the same ball park...e.g. the JSF vs the JXX

The next 20 years will be interesting with US defense budgets shrinking...and China's growing by 10%+/year

Now that you've been schooled... run along lika nice likkle student an leff dis cause it bigga dan yuh google abilities ..... woooiiieee mi wizzy!!

[Don1]

I cannot assist an ignoramus who is determined to remain ignorant at all costs. Take your petty concerns to the authors of the research paper presented if you wish to query their conclusions

[Don1]

You are an idiot if you really believe the USA will be concerned about 5th Generation plane operation 30 years from now.. much less 40 !

LOL!!! ... this is where you really show comprehensive ignorance

It takes about 15 years to design, build, test and bring a modern warplane to maturity ... then the lifecycle of the design after maturity (IF it is successful) is typically another 25 years or more... yuh nuh know dat

F-15s & F-16 & FA-18s were introduced in the 1970s... and guess what?? If the US were to go to war tomorrow those 40 year old designs would do most of the combat sorties... as they did in Afghanistan & Iraq

It's time you quit before you embarrass yourself further yuteman

[Muadib]

It is time you quit.. it not even funny anymore.. how many Chiney 5th Gen are in operation ?

What is the latest National Enquirer report on di Chiney plane dem ?

[Don1]

That is NOT the question. Your red herring is not even artful

The question under discussion is the trajectory of Chinese aerospace tech and the fact that 30 years ago it was nowhere....and today it is competitive with the best in the world in some areas.

In 20 years the trends suggest even more competitiveness on the part of the Chinese... that's clear to all intelligent aerospace analysts

But one cannot take the ignorance out of every ignoramus can one

[Muadib]

Wrong again.. your statement is that 'experts' state that China will surpass the USA in critical aerospace technology in 20 years...

There is no basis for such a quixotic statement as there is no indication the USA has any intentions to discontinue their Military and Aerospace spend and R&D to maintain absolute dominance and technology superiority...

IRBM: 'Defunct' technology with no clear political upside or cost-benefit analysis to support further development. Why make more bow and arrows ?



Fighter Planes: USA is operationally 1 generation or 20 years ahead of everyone else.. whichever yuh raddah.. and there is NO indication that this can be closed in 20 years... Chiney even a mek dem ownah engine yet ???

[Don1]

Ben fi yuh ignorance of military/aerospace is comprehensive

Ben yuh new to dis suh mi affi tek time wid yuh

=Muadib;459684]Wrong again.. your statement is that 'experts' state that China will surpass the USA in critical aerospace technology in 20 years...

Yes...experts have stated the likelihood of China equalling or surpassing the US in certain critical aerospace technologies.... and I have already demonstrated that has occurred in stealth jets & IRBM tech... by tech purchase, theft and their own native development

There is no basis for such a quixotic statement as there is no indication the USA has any intentions to discontinue their Military and Aerospace spend and R&D to maintain absolute dominance and technology superiority...

LOL... more ignorance. The US is overstretched and involved in disastrous foreign meddling which is threatening fiscal stability...so it is retrenching in military spending... the fact that you're unaware of this is stunning
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/07/us...ding.html?_r=0

IRBM: 'Defunct' technology with no clear political upside or cost-benefit analysis to support further development. Why make more bow and arrows ?

LOL!! Mi Belly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Who made you an expert on the politico-military significance of IRBM tech????? Dis tek di cake!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gwaan Chemical Ben!!!

Maybe some forumites may take your idiocy seriously but I prefer the opinions of experts in the field:

In short the PRC's expanding aerospace capabilities are influencing the development of similar capabilities in other defense establishments including the United States

China's successes in designing, developing and producing the world's largest and most sophisticated arsenal of medium and intermediate range of ballistic missiles create a demand for similar capabilities around the world.

Cease your uninformed, laughable yappin'...this case is long closed

Fighter Planes: USA is operationally 1 generation or 20 years ahead of everyone else.. whichever yuh raddah.. and there is NO indication that this can be closed in 20 years... Chiney even a mek dem ownah engine yet ???

Your ignorant yappin is boundless!!!!!!!! Chemical Ben strikes again!!!

FYI the F-35 is THE most modern warplane about to enter the US fleet within 3 years or so as an operational platform...and most unfortunately the plane is already a turkey which in expert opinion is on its way to becoming a sitting duck in a shooting war... and many believe it should be scrapped to stanch the losses:

RAND study
The F-35's inferiority became glaringly obvious five years ago in a computer simulation run by John Stillion and Harold Scott Perdue, two analysts at RAND, a think tank in Santa Monica, California. Founded in 1948, RAND maintains close ties to the Air Force. The air arm provides classified data, and in return RAND games out possible war scenarios for government planners

APA study

Any notion that an F-35 Joint Strike Fighter or F/A-18E/F Super Hornet will be capable of competing against this Chengdu design in air combat, let alone penetrate airspace defended by this fighter, would be simply absurd. The F-35 Joint Strike Fighter and F/A-18E/F Super Hornet are both aerodynamically and kinematically quite inferior to the as presented J-XX/J-20 design, and even the shape based VLO capability in the J-XX/J-20, as presented, will effectively neutralise any sensor advantage either type might possess against earlier Russian and Chinese fighter designs.

Now if you wish to continue to parade your lack of even basic understanding of aerospace developments against the technical competence of practitioners in the field...please do so... It's good for a few Holiday Laughs...LOL..Mi Spleen!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Muadib]

The next 20 years will only be interesting in your imagination...

Like your imaginary Chinese 5th Gen operational data...

It would have to be operational to compare apples to apples...

[Muadib]

You yapping nonsense Donzero..

How can Chinese IRBM development influence USA development of similar capabilities.. USA cannot develop IRBM based on INF Treaty.. silly fellow..