Can't agree with Tuftons position here although

[Islandman]

I wouldn't put back Tufton right away if I were Holness. He has some interesting ideas, but talks a lot , loves press coverage and credit for doing relatively little.

Not saying I would not find a place for him but it would have to be somewhere him couldn't sabotage me.

JLP is once again in a mess unfortunately.

[Assasin]

Mess is relative. If they have their party and Jamaican at heart they will sit down and find a way to work as a team. I don't want to work with people who always agree with me or who don't have ambition.

They all simply need to grow up and realize that we live in a democracy. Not too long ago the Democrats were in pieces and they rally as a team and grew.

[Lazie]

I wouldn't put back Tufton right away if I were Holness. He has some interesting ideas, but talks a lot , loves press coverage and credit for doing relatively little.

Not saying I would not find a place for him but it would have to be somewhere him couldn't sabotage me.

JLP is once again in a mess unfortunately.

Credit for doing relatively little? Really? How soon people forget?

[Willi]

I am no lover of Tufton, but consider the alternative (Roger Clarke). Him mek Tufton look like star! LoL

In any case, Holness needs Shaw/Tufton more than he needs them. He wants to unseat Portia? It cant be done without 40% of his base. Portia provided a great template for this. We can cuss her for her lack of good governance, but her political savvy cant be faulted in her post challenge dealings with PP. Social intelligence is needed, but Holness relying on "masculine" energies here (8) when what is needed is the feminine energy (2)….diplomacy over executive power.

Holness is young to dis.

[Islandman]

Well I consider Clarke a fossil, anything breathing would have more to contribute to agriculture than him.

Holness playing very dirty but Tufton is no angel either is all I am saying.

[Jawge]

Oh so now yuh ah come straight? Call it willi: Nanny P is a bright political mind.

[Time]

Look like Tufton is winning the PR battle over the letter. He dared Holness to use the pre-signed letter and a face public backlash.

1. Round 1 goes to Tufton for forcing Holness to the letter,
2. Round 2 goes to Holness for using the letter
3. Round 3 goes to Tufton for revealing the letter
4. Round 4 goes to Holness for pointing out that it was started by Bustamante
5. Round 5 goes to Tufton because the public don't like the idea of these pre-signed letters.

Holness, your move.


Integrity of Senate 'shattered', Constitution 'trampled on' - NDM







Published: Sunday November 17, 2013 | 12:44 pm 8 Comments


Opposition leader Andrew Holness - File




The National Democratic Movement (NDM) says the integrity of the Senate has been "shattered" and the Constitution "trampled on" following revelation that all eight opposition senators were instructed to sign resignation letters as a precondition to their appointment.

In a release last night, the NDM - Jamaica's third political party - said the Constitution had been "trampled on" and that the country had been "brought to a new low". The political party says the governor general, parliament and the president of the senate should seek to have the matter probed urgently.

Last week Arthur Williams revealed that senators were asked by Opposition leader Andrew Holness to sign undated resignation letters when they were appointed to ensure they would not depart from the Jamaica Labour Party’s stance on the issue of the Caribbean Court of Justice.

Williams issued the statement following reports that he and Dr Christopher Tufton had resigned as Opposition Senators.

Holness had asked all eight senators to resign following his victory over Audley Shaw last week in a caustic leadership battle, but Dr Tufton, a known supporter of Shaw, had refused to resign. Holnes consequently enforced the letters of resignation and named a fresh slate of senators which excluded Tufton.

The move by Holness has come in for much criticism by members of the public and commentators, who have described it as underhanded and unethical. Analysts have also suggested that it could have implications for the independence of the senate.

[Willi]

No one disputed that. She just sucks at governance! GG material, not PM material.

[Time]

Clearly Holness is the dumb one here.

Tufton nuh have nutten fi lose, Holness just blot his own copybook, but alienating 40% of his base.

The Trini secret buss. Trinidad has/had the same system. That is how the British taught us to enforce political policy.

EDITORIAL - Mr Holness right on Senate resignations

Published: Monday | November 18, 2013 5 Comments




Andrew Holness last week used a tactic that was part of the arsenal of Eric Williams, the late prime minister of Trinidad and Tobago.It shouldn't have had to come to that. Except that there are persons in the [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]Jamaica[/COLOR][/COLOR] Labour Party (JLP) seemingly intent on expropriating the mandate Mr Holness won a week ago. Lest we forget, 57 per cent of party delegates voted for him.
Dr Williams, during his more than quarter-century hold on the Trinidadian government, it is said, never had to fire a Cabinet. They always 'resigned'.
The claim is that on being drafted into the Cabinet, ministers initialled not only their instruments of appointment, but also undated letters of resignation which Dr Williams kept in his files for their appropriate use.
Having been challenged and prevailing, Mr Holness quite rightly expected that he would be given a free hand to shape the JLP. If he is a perceptive leader, Mr Holness would be mindful that the greater responsibility was his to lead the healing in his party, which would preclude wholesale alienation of those who opposed him.
CONSTITUTIONAL LOOPHOLE
Not inappropriately, in our view, Mr Holness signalled that he would welcome the resignations, en bloc, of the eight senators he caused to be appointed. The Jamaican Constitution does not provide either the prime minister or the leader of the Opposition with the power to insist upon any such revocation.
In the event, two senators resisted: Arthur Williams and Christopher Tufton, the latter a front-line supporter of Mr Holness' challenger, Audley Shaw. During the campaign, Dr Tufton scathingly questioned Mr Holness' character.
It turns out that Mr Tufton appeared to have forgotten that Mr Holness, like Dr Williams, possessed their signed, but undated, letters of resignation.
Arthur Williams has explained that those letters were to ensure that JLP's senators did not defect and give the Government the two-thirds parliamentary majority required to take Jamaica into the criminal and civil jurisdiction of the [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]Caribbean[/COLOR][/COLOR] Court of Justice. Mr Williams questions the moral and, perhaps, constitutional efficacy of using the resignations for purposes "unconnected to any issue with the Caribbean Court of Justice".
POLICY SUPPORT
By signing these letters, Mr Williams and his colleagues clearly accepted the principle that a leader is entitled to an assurance that appointees would not depart from fundamental party policies.
Mr Williams misses the point. For while they parade the absence of constitutional power of leaders to revoke Senate appointments and highlight the Upper House as a deliberative forum, the fact that the the group signed the resignation letters underlines their appreciation of a party leader to be assured of the policy support of his appointees.
It might be useful to consider this matter from the perspective of a head of government. Suppose a prime minister, short of talent in the House and needing specialised skills to oversee [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]portfolios[/COLOR][/COLOR], appointed, via the Senate, four ministers who are technocrats from the private sector, with the intent that their jobs would be relatively short term. If those ministers, at the completion of their jobs, declined to resign, the prime minister would have limited options in shaping his or her government. This flaw in Section 42 of the Constitution is in need of fixing.
In Trinidad and Tobago, a fifth of its 31 senators are independent members appointed at the sole discretion of the [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]country's[/COLOR][/COLOR] president. That may be a model for Jamaica to consider.

The opinions on this page, except for the above, do not necessarily reflect the views of The Gleaner. To respond to a Gleaner editorial, email us: editor@gleanerjm.com or fax: 922-6223. Responses should be no longer than 400 words. Not all responses will be published.

[Islandman]

Exactly! When you say that dem say is cause you bias 'gainst working class black woman and the usual tripe.

[Willi]

Cabinet is not the same as Senate though.

Cabinet is a working Group that can reshuffle anytime. Senate is more like House of Lords. In Inglan, dem even have heriditary peerage!

[Time]

True but my guess is that if Eric Williams did it for the Cabinet which it appears that he could fire then he also did it for the Senate.

If we don't like it then we should change the law so that the letters cannot be accepted.

It is a British legacy man, some countries even do it for elected officials and that is clearly wrong. It still going on in Uncle Sam land for political appointments!

http://www.kshb.com/dpp/news/local_news/mayors-apointees-pre-sign-resignation-letters-mayor-can-resign-them-freely

http://triblive.com/news/adminpage/3769223-74/letters-fitzgerald-county#axzz2l1Auv1wl

http://ktemoc.blogspot.com/2009/02/legality-of-undated-resignation-letters.html


http://mylivingwall.com/en/politics-news-menu-71/6330-pre-signed-resignation-void-even-karpal-agrees

[Assasin]

But you know that even in the US politics there are some basic litmus test to be appointed. One is Rowe Vs Wade etc. There is always some independence. If you really want independent senators you have to put it in the constitution and do not have the PM or opposition leader appoint them.