This not a fete in here - is madness!!!!

[Hortical]

What gets missed is the family structure, too many having children with multiple partners & the children are not raised in a stable environment. We can lock up people all day, but until there is serious discussion about the role of the family & fatherhood, then we are not looking at the issue of crime through a larger lense.

[Exile]

So are you saying people from 'stable' families don't commit crimes?

[Hortical]

The majority of persons in prisons are from single parent households, there is a lack of involvement of the father, and they read at a 5th grade level. Reducing crime can not solely be a para military soltuion.

[Islandman]

That I totally agree with...the crony capitalism is a big problem. Unfortunately since the politicians are part of the problem they are not going to be the solution, at least not the source of it.

[Exile]

Maybe more people from 'stable' families need to be imprisoned...don't think it's a para military solution...

[Exile]

We always blame the politicians but truth is the whole a Jamaica/TT is a corrupt, 'kleptocracy'....well, generally speaking...Politicians must have facilitators who they find in willing nationals....

[Islandman]

Yep, without a doubt. I always say that politicians are not a special breed of people different from the rest of the society they represent.

We have a leadership problem in almost all areas. Politics is just one of the more visible ones.

[Mosiah]

Simplistic yankee chatter. A desperate worker will agree to anything, because any attempt at negotiating a fair wage may mean he's denied the job.

It is about FAIR!

[Islandman]

It may be simplistic but unfortunately what HL says is true in a practical sense. If all you bring to the table is you two long hand and a strong back then Mr BigMan is never going to pay you what you believe is fair.

My relative in Panama trying to do some expansion on his house and he says he can't find any Panamanian to do the work anymore. Now what he REALLY means is that he can't afford to pay what the Panamanian construction worker is now demanding because work is everywhere!

Is that fair? And fair to whom? It really doesn't matter. Panama man nah work fe dat money because him can get more elsewhere. So either pay up or go find a immigrant worker from a poor English speaking Caribbean country not too far away who will work fe dat.

[HL]

You have time paying attention to Mosiah.

ALMOST EVERYTHing in Jamaica is negotiable!!!

I don't think he will do well as a business person with his 'fair' outlook.

[Exile]

I guess you are saying you can't be fair and be in business. Sorry Mosiah, you've been downgraded HL.

[HL]

I guess you are saying you can't be fair and be in business. Sorry Mosiah, you've been downgraded HL.

Don't guess Exile.

I am sure you understand the point I am making.

'Don't muddy the water'.

[Islandman]

When I pay my workers more than the market demands and have to set my price higher accordingly, and then Mr Wikid Man down the street pay his workers market rate and underprice me , how many people a go pay my higher price because I pay my employees more? History suggests that most will not, dem going to cuss Mr Wikid Man and still buy from him cause him "cheap".

Thats why people cuss Wal-Mart bout them low wages and China products, then turn round and buy from them and leave the Mom and Pop store fe go outta business. Then them go home and look pon them mutual fund statement with Wal-Mart stock and smile. LOL. I guess that is fair.

[HL]

There is a construction project in the Turks and Caicos that the locals refuse to work for. This same contractor hires willing immigrant chinese at a lower rate to accomplish the same tasks. I guess that's unfair.

I have a friend who owns a Roofing Company. He hires only US citizens. Several of his competitors employ workers from South and Central America. When we get together to have a beer, my Roofing friend complains how much he is losing money and contracts. Oh, BTW ...my friend is a republican......

Last, in the 80's I worked at a Medical College. The college hired lots of brilliant Indian doctors who wanted to work in the US. Almost all of these Indian physicians were undocumented. The college hired them to teach Anatomy and Physiology and other related medical subjects. They were paid a fraction of what a US citizen lecturing the same subject were paid. (I should mention that the College help them file for their green card).

Let me stop Islandman, i am preachin' to the choir.

BTW...excellent case study using Wal Mart!!

It's not what is fair...it's what negotiable.

[Islandman]

Globalization certainly has its winners and losers but taken as a whole I am all for it. In the long run there is more benefit for all. Just like what happened in the Industrial Revolution, the Luddites did not like the new opportunities available and revolted but they lost and the world is a FAR better place now because of it.

I hire contract work from time to time to do basic programming , graphic design, web development, etc. I have found EXCELLENT resources online based in places like Bangladesh offering rock bottom rates and I take full advantage of it. I apologize if I am being unfair to someone but I can't stop my clients from going elsewhere so either I prepare to play the game by the new rules or go home.