Gagged, kneeling body found in TG

[MissLondon]

LOL! Mosiah, Islandman pretty much explained my premise. For Tivoli to be responsible for most of the murders on the island, there would have to be over 1000 unrecorder murders in the community last year. Sorry I think that's far fetched.

[Islandman]

Define that for me. The boundaries seems to have expanded to even uptown these days.

My basic point (and I think MissLondons point) is that if you count up all the recorded and unrecorded TG murders and then all the non-TG murders, there will be a lot more non-TG murders.

I think Mo interpreted the original statement to be saying "TG is not the community with the most murders" and I agree that we could not say that with any certainty.

[Don1]

well if TG is the Mother of all Garrisons ...she must take responsibility for at least some of the actions of her children....

similarly should Seaga..... the Father of Tivoli

[Mosiah]

which community would be responsible for most of the murders on the island, i.e., more than 50% of the 1680?!?

answer - NONE!

that argument makes no sense whatsoever!

[MissLondon]

which community would be responsible for most of the murders on the island, i.e., more than 50% of the 1680?!?

answer - NONE!

that argument makes no sense whatsoever!

Who said one community is responsible for most of the murders on the island? You were the only who suggested such with Tivoli

[Gamma]

UNLESS what is being intimated is that persons from tivoli are responsible for the murders notwithstanding that the murders take place outside of tivoli

[Islandman]

Bredren, its like saying something like:

"Hotel occupancy is high in Negril, but since most of the tourists who visit Jamaica don't go to Negril, what is being done in the Negril needs to be replicated"

Same idea.

[Mosiah]

and how much of that actually happens?! we don't really know but it's widely believed that TG used to provide safe haven for many criminals.

the fact of the matter is, when you're talking about model communities, do not utter the worlds Tivoli Gardens!

[Mosiah]

again i quote:

most murders in Jamaica aren't commited in Tivoli or by Tivoli people

that's your statement.

so, i guess you are right!

[Rudi]

It's about time for assassain to pipe in and tell us how man in Arnette have to kneel down too. Step up. the defense of the indefensible knows no bounds whether on letterhead or not.

[ReggaeMike]

Well there is Old Tivoli (Tivoli Gardens), Little Tivoli (Lizard Town), North Tivoli (Denham Town), East Tivoli (Matthew's Lane and environs) and so forth (New Tivoli, Upper Tivoli and so on). Uptown areas of Greater Tivoli include Tivoli Heights (erroneously called by it's former name "Kirkland Heights") and Tivoli Estates (also known as "Plantation Heights").

[Karl]

well if TG is the Mother of all Garrisons ...she must take responsibility for at least some of the actions of her children....

similarly should Seaga..... the Father of Tivoli

The questions I would pose to MissLondon and others are, what is the method or what are the methods used to arrive at Tivoli's contribution to murders?

...and would that include distribution of guns and ammunition to others who use same in the furtherance of murders?

...and would that also include murders that were not committed under direct orders coming out of Tivoli?

...or committed by persons without direct connection with others in Tivoli but who carry out murders via direction received from third parties, etc???

I am also thinking on how many of the guns or the ammunition used to commit these murders enter the island...end up in the hands of the murderer as a result of Tivoli's import pipeline(s) or avenues - illegal imports (wharf, airports, unsecured borders), stolen, bribed officials to turn a blind eye, etc., etc?

[Don1]

The questions I would pose to MissLondon and others are, what is the method or what are the methods used to arrive at Tivoli's contribution to murders?

...and would that include distribution of guns and ammunition to others who use same in the furtherance of murders?

...and would that also include murders that were not committed under direct orders coming out of Tivoli?

...or committed by persons without direct connection with others in Tivoli but who carry out murders via direction received from third parties, etc???

I am also thinking on how many of the guns or the ammunition used to commit these murders enter the island...end up in the hands of the murderer as a result of Tivoli's import pipeline(s) or avenues - illegal imports (wharf, airports, unsecured borders), stolen, bribed officials to turn a blind eye, etc., etc?

the sins of the Mother are visited upon the Children

[Exile]

Agreed but no one knows the number committed by TGites do they? That is OUTSIDE the community in the 1600+.

[Exile]

Actually, you are both wrong. The crime stats (the #s) do not give the details of the crimes committed. A murder in Mobay could the responsibility of Grizzlies from Tivoli....a robbery, thuggery in Clarendon - a possibility as well....
Until the crime stats say WHO responsible for the murders -eg Shower Posse responsible for 352 murders, RBSC involved in 100 etc etc...then it will remain vague.
Then there are the indirect links.....