****oh My God A Brown Man Was Killed****

[Muadib]

It is claimed that the soldiers cut through grills, broke down doors, dragged him out of a room and shot him in front of his family ?

Bungling ??

Sumting Wong..

[Don1]

It is claimed that the soldiers cut through grills, broke down doors, dragged him out of a room and shot him in front of his family ?

Bungling ??

Sumting Wong..

call it what you will

[Mosiah]

Last time I checked, I haven't been proven wrong.

[Sickko]

Seaga and Lazie's hero Mutty Perkins still holds to this day that the police who were shot in the previous Tivoli incident were shot by their own colleagues..

[Sickko]

If it was an execution why leave witnesses?

[Islandman]

But nuh same Mutty did laugh and the absurdity of the claim that there were tunnels in Tivoli?

[ReggaeMike]

ReggaeMike ...this speculation of yours is really a huge leap even given the confusion surrounding the incident. Why would a family connection to either party make the account of his family unbelievable? That itself doesn't add up.

Most Jamaicans have political connections of some sort....so I guess virtually everyone's testimony in such a case could be tainted. Besides...the shooting was NOT in the context of a political war....but a popular assault against criminals.

The police apparently engaged gunmen at another house or houses nearby the site of the fatal shooting...then moved to Clarke's house for reasons unknown....it could be that their original targets fled in that direction,

Clarke has no known or reported association with criminality...but was a licensed firearm owner and found his house invaded in the middle of a long running gun battle.

This is a case of police bungling....there are quite a few of these every year..but usually not in areas like Kirkland Heights.

I never said the family makes a story unbelievable. I was saying that the story that a family relates can either sound plausible or not.

Hill's wife's story is quite believable on a number of grounds:

- there was serious accident.

- the police involved were not supposed to be there as they were on duty supposedly and hence could get in a lot of trouble (and sound as if they were in the wrong when it comes to the accident).

- the Hills have video evidence of the beatings by the police.

- the video evidence could land the police in question into even more trouble and they would thus have a motive to ensure Hill's untimely demise.


Clarke's family's story doesn't add up because at no point does their story explain:

- how they didn't realize that the helicopters were most likely security forces and not thieves.

- how a 2-3 hour gunbattle ensued. Even if no soldiers were injured the gunfire was quite heavy and quite sustained and nothing in their story accounts for it because if their story was the be all and end all then it means they heard helicopters and a rustling outside (their story does not indicate they heard gunfire before security forces went into their house), Clarke assumed it was thieves and hid his family in the bathroom and stayed in his bedroom, soldiers and police came in and asked where the gunmen were in the house, Mrs. Clarke told them it was only her husband, they found Mr. Clarke and shot him and then we had an the JCF and JDF use the area as a shooting range for 2-3 hours.

- gives no account of Dudus' lieutenant, Justin O'Gilvie owning a house nearby (it was friends of the family who apparently suggested someone may have run from O'Gilvie's house to the Clarke house and that this may have lead, in part, to the JCF/JDF action).

The Clarke's family's story may be partially true but it certainly cannot be the whole story otherwise we are forced to believe that the security forces let off gunfire for 2 hours idly and that Clarke was silly enough to hear helicopters and assume it was thieves and then hid his entire family in one part of the house while he stayed in another in order to protect them (yet the security forces came across the family first when they went into the house and had that been thieves then it means Clarke would have utterly failed in his goal of protecting them).

[ReggaeMike]

Is white americans seh so!

Oh well, yes of course (I have friends in the States who have related similar incidents from white and black Americans). But remember Bush II called Greeks "Grecians". Geography (including population geography and the related fields of ethnography) is not a strong subject among many Americans of all colours.

[Muadib]

yes.. the hiding in separate bathrooms sounds odd..

Regarding the shooting for 2 hours.. he could have been killed at the start of the operation then a chase ensued into other parts of the neighborhood..

I understand it turned into a running battle. I know for sure the helicopter landed further up the Hill..

[ReggaeMike]

yes.. the hiding in separate bathrooms sounds odd..

Regarding the shooting for 2 hours.. he could have been killed at the start of the operation then a chase ensued into other parts of the neighborhood..

I understand it turned into a running battle. I know for sure the helicopter landed further up the Hill..

Sure he could have been killed at the start, but the family's story only leaves people to speculate that a chase ensued in other parts of the neighbourhood. Why not relate it?

[Don1]

The fog of war....Let's leave it at that.

[Don1]

Some man de pon first name basis Mo. In this case you no want follow Bricktop. In this case familiarity breeds an early dirt nap. Ask Briky when him a fly down fi shoot a video with "Chris"

LOL

A blast from the past... "Chris" tuh di Wirl!!