Jamaica vs. Trini Cultural Expression

[Historian]

Naminirt’s comment this morning about soca taking over Jamaica in ten year’s time got me thinking about Jamaica’s premier popular cultural expression when compared with our Caribbean neighbors.

It is very interesting, in my view, that until Byron Lee introduced Trinidad-style carnival, we did not have a popular cultural expression form in which the society as a whole participated in an active way. Sure we have probably had more forms of cultural expression than any other regional country, and I’m talking here about things like pantomime, the NDTC annual series, Reggae Sunsplash, Reggae Sumfest, Sting, Jamaica Jazz & Blues Festival, Jerk Festival, Yam Festival, Denbigh Agricultural Show, etc.

However, in all of these most people have been passive onlookers (that is, the audience) rather than actively taking part. This is in stark contrast to other Caribbean countries such as Trinidad with its massive carnival, Barbados with its equally large Crop Over, the Bahamas with its huge Junkanoo groups, St Lucia with its Carnival and its Creole Day, Guyana with its Mashramani and Diwali, and so on.

In all these festivals, a large proportion of the ordinary citizenry of each country takes part in an active way (rather than passively) in these cultural expressions.

By the way, it’s always been my view that when one compares all the English speaking Caribbean islands, soca has had its least success in Jamaica. Is this because of our solitary location? (A glance at any map of the Caribbean will illustrate what I mean by “solitary location.”)

[Naminirt]

mosiah will keep away from this topic

[Assasin]

As a very young kid we use to participate in Jankoonu dances in the street at Christmas time(that is the country people I know). I was also talking to my aunt who told me about a group my Grandma use to be a part of in St.Mary when farming was King.

I think we lost a lot that cultural activity from the 70s when people got divided, you were either PNP or JLP, Baldhead or Rasta, Left or right, Christian or Worlian, and fear took over.

This also reflected in the lack of community developement. Now it is a little better. Things like Carnival takes a lot of planning and a lot of community imput to be real successful.

[Sir X]

Carnival is an uptown thing looked on as an oddity in Jamaica, its relegated to uptown Kingston , dancehall on the other hand........

Wishfull thinking if you ask me , I think they risk the wrath of being shot up in the garrisons , it is viewed as a chi chi movement , man a wine pan man...lol

Bring back Johnkunno.

[Sir X]

I would also like to add the influence of reggae on Brooklyn carnival , The reggae artist floats are the hottest and the Jamaicans see it as an opp to set up boxes and blast reggae music at every street corner like a typical yaad session gathering crowds galore.with the police trying thier best to move traffic along.

[Naminirt]

Its just one reggae float in broolyn X that why the crowd is very big behind it ....

[Me]

Carnival was/is driven and controlled by the uptown crew. However, all those people behind Byron Lee Truck every year and in the final fete is certainly not uptown folks. Matter of fact, many of the "turn up nose crew" have been complaining that carnival start get too downtown.

As for Garrison, mi hear Kevin Little, Allison Hinds and Rupee songs playing in the garrison, not to mention that the daggering songs that were the in thing in dancehall, were based on soca.

[Lionpaw]

Soca, take over Jamaica??? Hahahaha. u mean take over the uptown fishes? We got our own Soca in "daggering", which is basically a sub-genre of dancehall.

[Sir X]

LOL and how much sound man on every corna ?

[Exile]

These arguments are pointless. Which music taking over. The usual ********************man argument - all fallow. It will continue to change with time.
As a youth there was a programme on radio called Calypso corner at 6:55 am everyday and Lee, Sparrow, Kitchener et al. were BIG in Jamaica (check the album Sparrow meets the Dragon).
I was introduced to C'val as a teenager at UWI who was mystified by the passionate embrace of the students from the EC of steelpan music, last lap (ring road), mas, fetes, a huge show and even j'ouvert. The UWI Guild even took the show on the road to Ocho Rios and there was great interest. Lee's interest was later with the actual commercialization and business aspect brought to the forefront with the involvement of uptown and sponsors. Then Portmore and others came on board. It has lost it popularity for a number of reasons. Sustainability was one. The older heads are out, no re-growth, not enough young people, in-fighting, popular dancehall culture, fear, ignorance, lack of money, sponsors.
Carnival is a people thing and is not driven by events and management. We never had the history and culture and the critical undivided mass to successfully sustain it. Susprisingly, other places which have embraced it have been successful - Nottinghill, Canada, NY....and have the $$ and people.
I have lived in Trinidad for years now and I am still mystified by the energy, creativity and largescale involvement of the populace in the different activities of C'val. The purists complain - mas costumes are being imported from China, steel bands using amplification, involvement of dancehall music and culture, rise of the all-inclusive fetes, etc. Bottomline is that it will change and change to survive. People complain but will fork out US$100 for a fete (x10), US$500+ for a costume, shows etc...

Where there is fear, the people will live darkness.

[Historian]

Well and Accurately Stated!

Thank you for making this very good post, Exile. Your arguments here are logical and straight to the point! I agree with your position and with your well-argued points.

The entire focus of my post #1, which started this thread, became lost in some of the comments that followed. My basic premise was that, unlike many other Caribbean popular cultures, Jamaica does not have a culture that involves the mass of the people as active participants, except for the Trinidad-style carnival which Byron Lee introduced some two decades ago. Our culture generally involves the mass of the people being audience members enjoying the display by a handful of people.

My other thesis was that soca is probably less popular in Jamaica than in the other English speaking Caribbean countries (and mainland Guyana). The only reason I could think of, and which I gave, was Jamaica’s geographically isolated position when compared with the other Caribbean countries.

These arguments are pointless. Which music taking over. The usual ********************man argument - all fallow. It will continue to change with time.

Lee's interest was later with the actual commercialization and business aspect brought to the forefront with the involvement of uptown and sponsors. Then Portmore and others came on board. It has lost it popularity for a number of reasons. Sustainability was one. The older heads are out, no re-growth, not enough young people, in-fighting, popular dancehall culture, fear, ignorance, lack of money, sponsors.
Carnival is a people thing and is not driven by events and management. We never had the history and culture and the critical undivided mass to successfully sustain it. Susprisingly, other places which have embraced it have been successful - Nottinghill, Canada, NY....and have the $$ and people.
I have lived in Trinidad for years now and I am still mystified by the energy, creativity and largescale involvement of the populace in the different activities of C'val. The purists complain - mas costumes are being imported from China, steel bands using amplification, involvement of dancehall music and culture, rise of the all-inclusive fetes, etc. Bottomline is that it will change and change to survive. People complain but will fork out US$100 for a fete (x10), US$500+ for a costume, shows etc...

Where there is fear, the people will live darkness.

[Willi]

Yup,

Junkanno used to be HUGE in Spanish Town.

[Willi]

Calypso Corner was massive for real!

[Assasin]

yeah I can clearly remember from Annotto Bay to Buff Bay and in Port Antonio you had Jankoonoos walking on the street and music playing everybody would run to the roadside and join in as they heard the Jankoonoo music passing. I personally was "fraid" a them so I would go close but not too close. Those things were sooner forgotten at Christmas time, what a shame. With that went the Quadrile and Maypole dances too.

[Lazie]

Soca, take over Jamaica??? Hahahaha. u mean take over the uptown fishes? We got our own Soca in "daggering", which is basically a sub-genre of dancehall.

Bull5hit! That daggering foolishness is nothing close to soca.