Finally some decent security policies from Bruce

[Mosiah]

Even with the driver's licence law, no policeman will lock up an uptown man/woman for not having a licence. But the poor will be thrown in jail immediately. Those in between will be bribed because they certainly don't want to go to jail with those murderers just because they left their wallets in another pants.

[Mosiah]

When Assasin does a better job promoting JLP policy than Lazie, tings bad fi yuh, Lazie!

[Lazie]

When Assasin does a better job promoting JLP policy than Lazie, tings bad fi yuh, Lazie!

Wasn't aware I was promoting JLP policy in this thread. Read and come again.

[Lazie]

Even with the driver's licence law, no policeman will lock up an uptown man/woman for not having a licence. But the poor will be thrown in jail immediately. Those in between will be bribed because they certainly don't want to go to jail with those murderers just because they left their wallets in another pants.

I don't see the big fuss about this. When yuh tek up yuh car keys ... check fi yuh license same time.

[Mosiah]

Not this thread. Difficult to do so when the thread is dealing with national security. We both agree that the JLP govt. has failed in that regard.

Fact is, PNP was not serious for 18 years. We thought the course would change, but I am yet to be convinced that this govt. is serious about really doing something about the crime situation.

[Assasin]

Like you I have been disappointed however law is not the problem. We have more laws on the books than most countries but everybody get a bly.

The fact is a lot more need to be done but how the hell do people drive without a license, this should have been a law long time.

Giving soldier some of the police rights is something I have advocate. Why having man preparing for war when we have war in our streets? The only foriegners wi going to fight is Vaz and him crew.

The DNA database is a must if we serious about crime. Not sure on the dentention issue. Mo no matter what policy we have in place if we continue to have corrupted lawyers, judge, and police then it nuh make nuh sense.

It is not why it couldn't be done 8 months ago? It is been done now and at least it has been done. It could have been done 10 years ago too.

[OJ]

thats dumb.. often I jump in my car to go to practise and is when I need to buy gas I realise **************** mi left mi wallet... so I should go the jail for that? If i get stopped I could get a ticket and 48 hours to produce my license.. Bruce got his priority mixed up.

[Lazie]

thats dumb.. often I jump in my car to go to practise and is when I need to buy gas I realise **************** mi left mi wallet... so I should go the jail for that? If i get stopped I could get a ticket and 48 hours to produce my license.. Bruce got his priority mixed up.

Its a situation where the good affi suffer for the bad. Initially I was against it, but after hearing how a vehicle was stopped, the driver pointed out how he forgot his license ... only to find out later .... after he got killed, "in a shootout" he was wanted by the police .. can you blame them?

Keep yuh car key and yuh license together. Yuh grab yuh key ... yuh grab yuh license.

Whatever proposal is put forward to deal with crime, somebody gonna complain. To complain bout this one is petty.

[Time]

What if I have other forms of ID?

Harsh penalties
Government contemplates drastic legislative changesBY PAT ROXBOROUGH-WRIGHT Editor-at-Large Western Bureau roxboroughp@jamaicaobserver.com
Monday, July 14, 2008


MONTEGO BAY, St James - Motorists who are caught behind the wheel without their driver's licences could be immediately locked up under proposed legislative changes being contemplated by the ruling Jamaica Labour Party, in a desperate bid to address the country's growing crime dilemma, highly placed sources told the Observer.
GOLDING. may decide to adopt measures in answer to the country's growing crime rate
"One strike and you're out. Once the police pull you over and you don't have it, that's it. you're gone. straight to the lock-up until you can produce it. No more five days grace period to produce anything," said our source.
According to the source, the draconian measure is one of several legislative changes that Prime Minister Bruce Golding may decide to adopt and announce this week in answer to the country's cry for the administration to do something to stem the tide of killings. The others concern:
. the expansion of powers currently available to the Jamaica Defence Force to include those available to the Jamaica Constabulary Force;
. a national DNA database which will be built up from information taken from blood samples of Jamaicans;
. a national fingerprint database; and
. an amendment to the Bail Act, which will see the period for which the police can legitimately detain an individual without charge moving up from 48 hours to 42 days in relation to cases of rape, murder, firearm offences, arson, affray and treason.
If Golding decides to implement the proposals, he will be sure to encounter strong opposition from human rights activists. In fact, just two weeks ago, House Speaker Delroy Chuck - a senior member of Golding's administration - closed the second joint meeting of the Caribbean Ombudsman Association and the Central American Council of Human Rights Ombudsmen with a warning that an adoption of the proposal to extend the period under which Jamaicans may be detained without charge, would give rise to an international scandal.
In addition to the warning, Chuck's closing address urged the Government to resist the temptation to adopt criminal-like behaviour in its endeavour to address the country's crime problem. His words were roundly endorsed by the meeting which was attended by several senior human rights icons, including Dr Lloyd Barnett of the Jamaica Independent Council for Human Rights; Public Defender Earl Witter; former Public Defender Howard Hamilton QC; and defence attorney Clayton Morgan.
There is also strong opposition to the proposal for extended detention among the Jamaican public as was revealed in the latest Observer/Don Anderson Poll published a week ago.
According to the poll, conducted between June 25 and July 2 among 1,000 persons islandwide, 50 per cent of respondents said that they would not support the proposal; 36 per cent were in favour of its introduction; 11 per cent were unsure about their position; and three per cent had no opinion.
Anderson said that opposition to the proposal from a demographic perspective "came more so from males, younger persons and persons in the lower socio-economic groups in the society", while "those who primarily favoured the proposal were more females and younger Jamaicans".
Added the pollster: "This proposal has been strongly opposed by some persons on the grounds that this would place too much power in the hands of the police in an environment where there are obvious concerns about the way they currently execute their duties."

... What if you forgot your drivers lic but you have another form of
government issued id?

[Lazie]

... What if you forgot your drivers lic but you have another form of
government issued id?

The man dem say fi have yuh license when yuh deh pon the road .. simply werk wid it. The one people should be more concerned about is detaining people for 40+ days without being charged.

[Assasin]

what they don't understand is that many of the criminals want no form of IDs as they can get away and not be identified. They can get other forms of fake IDs.

Sorry but the good have to suffer for the bad with that one. There is an intentional racket going on and not using dirver's license.

[Willi]

I dont see why 42 days, 14 days seem like a better compromise and I would advoocate that there be an initial 72 hours after which the police must inform the next of kin or legal counsel of the detainment.

This way, the police have time to work and the suspect is NOT "lost" in the system for weeks.

I bet you, the final result will be closer to what I propose.

[OJ]

Lazie bad laws are bad laws. You know better than providing that weak example. Let me ask you this, if he had his license what would have been the difference. They would look at his name and say hey you are going to shoot police or hey you wanted. Why did they not look at is face and do the same. Are they able to run a license or plate # to get info.. There is so much more one could do if they want to fix the issue but again we are misguided.

[Lazie]

Lazie bad laws are bad laws. You know better than providing that weak example. Let me ask you this, if he had his license what would have been the difference. They would look at his name and say hey you are going to shoot police or hey you wanted. Why did they not look at is face and do the same. Are they able to run a license or plate # to get info.. There is so much more one could do if they want to fix the issue but again we are misguided.

Getting in a bind about his specific move (if it is true) is comical. In the state that I live, they recently changed the law for driving without your driving documents. No ... a driver won't be locked up but there are some hefty fines. My wife calls me crazy sometimes as she sees me check for my wallet before going through the door, before going into the car and when I stop at the intersection on my street.

I don't hear no one complaining its a bad law ... we simply mek sure we have we documents.

Now .. inna Jamaica wha dem must duh? Fine dem? Dem already having problems collecting money fi outstanding tickets. There certainly is more that can be done ... but complaining about this is a waste of time. Yuh tek up yuh cyar key ... tek up yuh license .. simple.

[OJ]

Lazie in the state you live in you get fined not go to Jail for not having your license.. Let me ask you the bigger question... in what state or province in the USA or Canada you go to jail for not producing your license? Canada is one of the strictest country in the world.. btw.. Also bigger question what is the correlation for not having license and wanton murders? What is this a traffic problme we are having? I thought the issue was people on Murder rap getting bail.. I thought the issue is Judges gettign bribe.. I thought the issue is bad police evidence presentation and prep.. I thought the issue is a flawed witness protection and unconstitutionally long times in bringing cases to trial.. Unno tek people fi idiat with unno ****************ery all the time.. bout license.. and no ********************man this and that.. unno want get serious..