2015 CONCACAF U-17 FINAL TOURNAMENT: How good were we?

[Assasin]

The USA like us ended up with 10 points, The US play 2 90 minutes and didn't score a goal on us and wasn't threatening for most of the games. The didn't outplay us.

Is that what you call better????
One penalty made the difference.

[Don1]

The USA like us ended up with 10 points, The US play 2 90 minutes and didn't score a goal on us and wasn't threatening for most of the games. The didn't outplay us.

Is that what you call better????
One penalty made the difference.

Jamaica was clearly outclassed by a superior opponent....but not outscored. I deconstructed the play and demonstrated the big gap in the teams' technical and tactical abilities

Jamaica played Brazil in the 1998 Gold Cup to a 0-0 draw

By your specious reasoning it could be said Brazil was not then a superior team

It seems you're woefully lacking in the analytics department. Or perhaps your reasoning is temporarily Coloured by a personal bias.

[Assasin]

That is one game. Again this is a tournament, and the US have the same amount of point Jamaica has. The fact is the US team was no threat in the two game and have the same amount of points we have. It is not like the US was dominant in any of the games. They had not one but two chances and they played against the same teams we did only to have the same amount of points so how do you make them "a better team" for neat passes and running into space??? LOL!!!

At no stage did they create a lot of clear cut chances, at no stage they were totally dominant. They played for 180 minutes against us and didn't score a goal so what make them so much better?

[Don1]

That is one game. Again this is a tournament, and the US have the same amount of point Jamaica has. The fact is the US team was no threat in the two game and have the same amount of points we have. It is not like the US was dominant in any of the games. They had not one but two chances and they played against the same teams we did only to have the same amount of points so how do you make them "a better team" for neat passes and running into space??? LOL!!!

At no stage did they create a lot of clear cut chances, at no stage they were totally dominant. They played for 180 minutes against us and didn't score a goal so what make them so much better?

This is pathetic reasoning. You are demonstrating that you cannot be taken seriously in knowledge of the game.

A team being technically and tactically superior to another does not necessarily equate to it being "totally dominant" or even in the team winning against a less developed opponent

Yuh claim seh yuh coach kids?????? Jah help dem to **** .

Wooooiiieee mi clavicle!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Assasin]

"A team being technically and tactically superior" That still don't make them a better team. There is a lot more that goes in been a better team. Arsenal is one of the most technical and tactical team in the EPL but hasn't been the best team in a long time.

Breaking down teams and scoring is a major part of any game and if the US team had that, they wouldn't be in the position where they have 10 points like us and can't score on us over 180 minutes.

No worry bout who I coach. I don't have to say anything, the record speaks for itself. If the US and Jamaica played for 5 more games, the scoreline don't look like it would be very different so I don't see how they are so much better than us. Tactics and play without end product doesn't mean it is all good, just easier to look and develop but doesn't mean nothing when you can't break down others.

[Karl]

Was not threatening? ...missing gimmes in both games and that is not threatening? Now I know...

What does it profit us to hide from obvious truth?

[Assasin]

The obvious truth is the stats. They ended with 10 points, same as us, played us over 180 minutes in space of a week and didn't score a goal. Never looked like they were going to win. There is a reason why Wigan and Blackpool who played beautiful ball are in the championship and Stoke City is in the EPL.

Show me your stats that is so overwhelming that makes them such a better team, knowing that efficiency is also a part of the game.

[Stonigut]

The bottom line stat which tells us which team is better, even with a draw is the ball possession tine, it tells the story of superior training, superior teamwork, superior time spent together and really superior skill utilization from a holistic standpoint in that tine and place.

Excellent example which many don't even realize the significance of the game which we need to build on was the utter domination of TNT in the Carib cup, we moved the ball with fluidity and ease and speed in their half and we totally show down their attack to the point of almost impotence. It was a draw and then we won on penalties but Ja was far superior team on that day.

It is for this exact reason why I continually advocate for a defense focus, press driven style with fast skillful individual players on the counter, such a team can beat superior team even with the superior team getting 70 percent ball possession.

This is not a game of best skilled team wins, it is a game of will and imposing what you want on the opponent. Much like Ali versus Foreman, one man clearly superior to the point of why are we even fighting, Ali played the perfect game of defense, suck up the pressure and counter on weakness.

[Don1]

"A team being technically and tactically superior" That still don't make them a better team. There is a lot more that goes in been a better team. Arsenal is one of the most technical and tactical team in the EPL but hasn't been the best team in a long time.

LOL!

So you concede that the RBZ is tactically & technically inferior to the USA

So now explain in what other so called "a lot more" areas Jamaica makes up this gaping deficit to be a TEAM equal to or better than the USA.

[Assasin]

The question was never if they were more technical. The question was if the were a better team and the answer to that is hell no. They have not proved it over this tournament.

[Don1]

The question was never if they were more technical. The question was if the were a better team and the answer to that is hell no. They have not proved it over this tournament.

LOL!! Yuh hopeless. Mi tell yuh bout yuh lack of reasoning & logic capability but it look like yuh case terminal

I said USA was a far better team BECAUSE of tactical & technical superiority. You conceded to US tactical/technical superiority but denied the assessment that their team is better.

So nature being what it is...in your view the JA team can only be either equal or better.

Now again...explain WHAT TEAM ELEMENTS MAKE the Jamaican team equal or better than the US?

[Assasin]

Where is your stats to show that and we have to talk about both games and the tournament as a whole. Superior training is just a part of the process to get you there but at the end of the day.... Ball possession is half of the story.

The very primary stats is that they have not been very penetrative during their games against Jamaica they can always keep the ball. It is not like we had one off game with them. Again tell me about the point that Jamaica finished above them in group. Jamaica was able to score on the US and they US wasn't able to score on Jamaica. Tell me again how they played two games in one week and was not very penetrative in the final third and you are a much better team?

[Assasin]

Again better technical players don't always lead to better teams and winning games. It has been proven over and over as it was US vs Jamaica. There is so much more to the game than technical players.

The US team couldn't penetrate our defense. These two teams look about the same. If they played 10 more times it seems it would still end up 0-0, 1-0 to either side. Over 5 games both have the same amount of points and not much in goal difference playing against same teams so I don't get how they are WAY superior. Not only did they not score on Jamaica, but they also had similar score line in the group against the opponents. Looking good at times and not so good at times. The American team had some strengths but so too did the Jamaican team.

Nothing more to say.

[Karl]

The obvious truth is the stats. They ended with 10 points, same as us, played us over 180 minutes in space of a week and didn't score a goal. Never looked like they were going to win. There is a reason why Wigan and Blackpool who played beautiful ball are in the championship and Stoke City is in the EPL.

Show me your stats that is so overwhelming that makes them such a better team, knowing that efficiency is also a part of the game.

That is not relevant to your statement that stated the USA TEAM was not threatening.

The USA like us ended up with 10 points, The US play 2 90 minutes and didn't score a goal on us and wasn't threatening for most of the games. The didn't outplay us.

- http://www.reggaeboyzsc.com/forum1/s...913#post512913

Why did you make such a statement?

Is a goal-scoring opportunity threatening?

I really cannot understand why so many tend to run from the truth on our U-17 play. It does not help the coaching staff or the players when we keep telling them falsehoods. The danger is they may believe the falsehoods and continue to make the same mistakes.

The question we must ask ourselves is; do we want to help or not?

Facts:
- In terms of results Colour and his charges performed well given the early education on the game his charges received.

- It was obvious to all that the quality of the TEAM did not live up to the 'assessed sum of the individual parts'. For some reason the players as individuals could not apply "commonsense" to achieve best results.

There was lack of consistency on:
- sharing the ball i.e. the movement and passing was poor...very, very poor. Following on to that sharing of the ball is the difficult to address rotation of the ball=direction of play inclusive of changing of same as such rotation was most often missing...Hey? ...there was almost no sharing of the ball so how could there be rotation of same or of point of attack or possession?

Example: Difficult to remember in this last match 3 or more passes being put together.

- basic concept of getting to where the ball can be played before the opponent was lacking;

- the matter of meeting under-hit balls was less than satisfactory;

- all TEAM-mates attacking and defending as structured TEAM entity was too often non-existent or when engaged in 'shambolic" i.e. players getting in each others way or some jogging to support - attack or defense;

- use of speed across ground.

...sub-sets such as 'setting up TEAM-mate on goal was a rarity!!!

Yet for all of the above we missed being at the U-17 World Cup by a loss in a penalty shoot out!!!

Conclusion:
First and foremost, it says that TALENT ABOUNDS!!!

Second, managing of the squad was excellent (Hey...the teacher=coach took a set of players with the identified faults above and organized and directed them to compete at a level whereon they almost made it to the FIFA U-17 final tournament.

Finally, it says TEACHING OF THE GAME at the earliest ages is extremely poor! ...i.e over the years - 6 through present age (into the players 17 years of life) the basics outlined in Facts: were not properly taught.


The final question to you on the tournament is - Which TEAM had the most clear-cut goal-scoring opportunities?

[Assasin]

How does telling them the truth not help. Does telling them the truth means that is not better to develop better technical skills? hell no.

It is however strange that none of you talking about the stats that matters only because you want to prove your points.
There was not too many clear cut chances. Over 5 games a very superior team massed 10 points as Jamaica and played 2 games not only not scoring but been scored on???? It is not just one game , not two but 6 games in the tournament.