Wenger...

[Warlord]

This is where club owners and club fans have diverging interests. Wenger is 100% aligned with ownership who are in this to make money (some owners are not - like the sheik and RA). If you were to look at the numbers of dollars spent, Wenger has been a frigging magician...and remember that everyone else did dash whey Henry, Wenger made him (and many others) a star.

I'm having some trouble believing the last part of your post. With the exception of Henri he has NOT unearthed any other *star* players for the club.
Also, Henry was at Juventus but couldn't get into the first team on a regular basis at the time because he played the same position as David Trezeguet who was infinitely better

As I publicly stated before... Wenger already had the finished product in Berkamp, Pires, Overmars, Parlour, Wiltord, Viera, Van Persie and Fabregas. He didn't discover any of them.

[Warlord]

Warlord, crawl back into your cave! You clueless. You know nothing about Arsenal. Arsenal was like an amateur club when Wenger took over. Have a look at them now!! Money is there now so it is just a matter of time.

Dunny,

Didn't Arsenal win league titles in the mid to late 80's? Didn't they win FA Cup, European Cup and Cup winner's cup in the 90's??? Do you not know your own football club's history???

I guess amateur clubs win prestigious titles like that huh? Stop being a Wenger apologists!!! I know u were always a big supporter of Wenger but c'mon son.... look at his resume. He's a horrible manager and he's lost alot more than he's ever won over 18 years.

[Warlord]

Wegner is a great coach warlord you got it wrong.. The issue is he believes what he belives.. Someone once said your tactics may change but your philosophy does not.. The side that was picked was void of any solid defensive midfielde and it left the back four open.. Gibbs was playing like a new Kingson skettell selling *****... the concern i have is against all the big teams on the road we got bitch box.. pool (not really a big team) but chesea and Man City.. that worries me as we need to defend a bit and keep the game close but I dont think Wegner thinks that way...

How can he be a great coach when he's consistently failed time and again and can't produce a winning mentality? He's a stubborn old man who has not got up to speed with the game of today.

Great coaches dominate their sport. They produce a winning environment. ie. Phil Jackson/Gregg Popovich... Alex Ferguson/J. Mourinho. Sorry but Wenger is who he is. Have you ever wondered why no other big club ever made a move for him? The greatest coaches/managers always get courted by top teams for a reason.

[Jangle]

Now, while I know you deep down in your heart know this is not the right answer, you still choose to vent your anger and anguish over you club's current position by deliberately being antagonistic. If you think Liverpool is not a big club, wait until Moyes is done his work at Old Trafford. The dictionary will be re-written!!!! LOL!!!

YNWA.

Look weh me come to Lawd Jeezas!!!!!

[Paul Marin]

I'm having some trouble believing the last part of your post. With the exception of Henri he has NOT unearthed any other *star* players for the club.
Also, Henry was at Juventus but couldn't get into the first team on a regular basis at the time because he played the same position as David Trezeguet who was infinitely better

As I publicly stated before... Wenger already had the finished product in Berkamp, Pires, Overmars, Parlour, Wiltord, Viera, Van Persie and Fabregas. He didn't discover any of them.

Really Warlord? Fabergas was 16 when he started with Wenger, Parlour as well, Viera 20 and played mostly in Milan's reserves before Wenger got him - that's the "finished product"? And which manager can only bring youths? Did you even know who Aaron Ramsey was before Wenger? Ashley Cole? Theo Walcott? Ox? Wilshire? Give credit where it is due. For anyone who looks at the facts, Wenger is a magician who has managed to remain in the top 4 for all of his seasons in charge despite a relatively MEAGER cash outlay. I believe I read somewhere that his average net spend per year in the time he has been at Arsenal was something like £3m. If that is true, that is nothing short of frigging amazing. That's a number you'd expect from Scunthorpe, not a top 4 club.

[Sir X]

Ouch

[Paul Marin]

How can he be a great coach when he's consistently failed time and again and can't produce a winning mentality? He's a stubborn old man who has not got up to speed with the game of today.

Great coaches dominate their sport. They produce a winning environment. ie. Phil Jackson/Gregg Popovich... Alex Ferguson/J. Mourinho. Sorry but Wenger is who he is. Have you ever wondered why no other big club ever made a move for him? The greatest coaches/managers always get courted by top teams for a reason.

Warlord, where do you get your facts? Which big club moved for Alex Ferguson? Who moved for Mourinho when he was at Chelsea? There are only a handful of clubs that wouldn't be a step down for Wenger. That said, you forget that both Lyon and PSG made noise about getting Wenger. Secondly, you cannot look at Wenger's record without looking at the prevailing circumstances. Arsenal's board is about making money. They could give a sh!t about winning silver. Since moving to the Emirates, Wenger has bought £180m in players and sold £230m worth. Compare that number to Chelsea, Manu** and City. City in the last 5 years has spent a net of over £400m!!! There is simply no denying that what Wenger has done with less than spectacular resources in keeping your club in the top 4 is nothing short of wizardry. It is that simple. Keep chatting the way you are and you might just end up with your own David Moyes.

[Jangle]

Keep chatting the way you are and you might just end up with your own David Moyes.

Or just take David Moyes from us.

[Warlord]

Really Warlord? Fabergas was 16 when he started with Wenger, Parlour as well, Viera 20 and played mostly in Milan's reserves before Wenger got him - that's the "finished product"? And which manager can only bring youths? Did you even know who Aaron Ramsey was before Wenger? Ashley Cole? Theo Walcott? Ox? Wilshire? Give credit where it is due. For anyone who looks at the facts, Wenger is a magician who has managed to remain in the top 4 for all of his seasons in charge despite a relatively MEAGER cash outlay. I believe I read somewhere that his average net spend per year in the time he has been at Arsenal was something like £3m. If that is true, that is nothing short of frigging amazing. That's a number you'd expect from Scunthorpe, not a top 4 club.

I can't believe we're even discussing this but since we are...let's keep it all tha way real!!! Fabregas was 16 yrs when he got to Arsenal.. that's 100% true but how in tha hell can you compare Barcelona's Youth Player Development Program to Arsenal's is beyond me???

You talk of giving Wenger credit. Give him credit for what exactly??? He didn't unearth Fabregas. Barcelona did!!! Fabregas just couldn't make the first team at the time because they were stacked and decided to let him walk. Their scouts and coaches obviously saw his talent and brought him in very young and developed him. C'mon son Give Barca their due! All Wenger did was play him he didn't unearth him!!!

Viera was around 20 and was in the same position at Milan. He couldn't break their first team because they already had more talented players in his position at the time. Thistype of thing happen every day in professional football. That's why teams get compensated.

Sure on a budget Wenger stayed somewhat competitive. There are other teams that have done the same over a time period, but you cannot WIN titles/chhampionships in professional sports doing that. You have to spend BIG $$$$ to win. That philosophy NEVER changes. Wenger/Arsenal have also been known to be a selling club and because of their idiocy of not holding on to their best talent they almost always ended up on the losing end.

[Jangle]

Wenger/Arsenal have also been known to be a selling club and because of their idiocy of not holding on to their best talent they almost always ended up on the losing end.

Hot patty!!!!Hot Patty!!! Warlord is back and he's on the WARPATH!!!! Him CROSS, HANGRY n MISERABLE!!!!! Over to yous Gummers. Paul keep yuh Loserfool self out the Gummers business. Dem done have dem lawyer fi defend themselves.

[Sir X]

Martinez or Klopp ,I think this season is his last hopefully he can go with an FA cup...save face.

Paul your theory only applies to Arsenal no other club in the top 6 has that luxury and its not because of oil or Russian money.

[Warlord]

Warlord, where do you get your facts? Which big club moved for Alex Ferguson? Who moved for Mourinho when he was at Chelsea? There are only a handful of clubs that wouldn't be a step down for Wenger. That said, you forget that both Lyon and PSG made noise about getting Wenger. Secondly, you cannot look at Wenger's record without looking at the prevailing circumstances. Arsenal's board is about making money. They could give a sh!t about winning silver. Since moving to the Emirates, Wenger has bought £180m in players and sold £230m worth. Compare that number to Chelsea, Manu** and City. City in the last 5 years has spent a net of over £400m!!! There is simply no denying that what Wenger has done with less than spectacular resources in keeping your club in the top 4 is nothing short of wizardry. It is that simple. Keep chatting the way you are and you might just end up with your own David Moyes.

Both Sir Alex and Mourinho could've left their clubs and gone on to manage elsewhere but they were committed to their respective clubs at the time. I know you're NOT naive enough to think they weren't approached by another other team(s).

As a matter of fact when Mourinho left Chelsea after his first spell with them did he not manage Real Madrid then Inter Milan???

If Arsenal ever decided to fire Wenger he will NEVER manage a top 5 club at any of the top leagues in Europe ever again. He has managed to alienate so many players during his career I can't keep count how many players bolted from Arsenal during his tenure.

Now I said it before and im gone say it again, every franchise/club goes into business to turn a profit. Name me one company who doesn't? Arsenal is no different from anyone else. Sure the club can't compete with clubs like Man City, MU and Chelsea because of spending power...but buying scrubs season after season and expecting to win consistently will never work in this environment. Its already been proven during his tenure. I don't care about maintaining top 5 status if Im not winning. That alone tells the story why the aforementioned teams will always be better because they want to win and will always put themselves in the best position to achieve that goal

[Warlord]

There is simply no denying that what Wenger has done with less than spectacular resources in keeping your club in the top 4 is nothing short of wizardry.

Spurs have done that for a long long time. Wigan also did that for a while. Do I need to go on??? Wenger hasn't done anything special IMO

[Karl]

I'm having some trouble believing the last part of your post. With the exception of Henri he has NOT unearthed any other *star* players for the club.

Also, Henry was at Juventus but couldn't get into the first team on a regular basis at the time because he played the same position as David Trezeguet who was infinitely better

As I publicly stated before... Wenger already had the finished product in Berkamp, Pires, Overmars, Parlour, Wiltord, Viera, Van Persie and Fabregas. He didn't discover any of them.

Beg to differ -
As they arrived at "Wenger's school" and sat at the feet of Master Teacher Arsene Wenger:

You are FULL 100 correct on TH14

It was at Arsenal that Henry made his name as a world-class footballer. Despite initially struggling in the Premier League, he emerged as Arsenal's top goal-scorer for almost every season of his tenure there. Under long-time mentor and coach Arsène Wenger, Henry became a prolific striker and Arsenal's all-time leading scorer with 228 goals in all competitions. The Frenchman won two league titles and three FA Cups with the Gunners; he was nominated for the FIFA World Player of the Year twice, was named the PFA Players' Player of the Year twice, and the FWA Footballer of the Year three times. Henry spent his final two seasons with Arsenal as club captain, leading them to the 2006 UEFA Champions League Final.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thierry_Henry

a) Dennis Bergkamp -

Bergkamp signed for Italian club Inter Milan in 1993, where he had two disappointing seasons. He then joined Arsenal in 1995. It was at Arsenal where Bergkamp rejuvenated his career, helping the club to win three Premier League titles, four FA Cup trophies and reach the 2006 UEFA Champions League Final, which marked his last appearance as a player. With the Netherlands national team, Bergkamp surpassed Faas Wilkes's record to become the country's top goalscorer of all time in 1998.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Bergkamp

b) Patrick Viera -

He rose to prominence during a hugely successful spell at Arsenal from 1996 to 2005.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Vieira#Honours

c) Cesc Fabregas -

...was signed by Premier League side Arsenal in September 2003 at the age of 16. Following injuries to key midfielders in the 2004–05 season, he went on to establish himself as Arsenal's starting central midfielder, playmaker and captain. He broke several of the club's records in the process, earning a reputation as one of the best young players for his position

It was not until the start of the 2004–05 season that the Spaniard started making first team appearances in matches outside the League Cup. His first match of the season was against Manchester United in the FA Community Shield. Following an injury to Vieira, Fàbregas stepped in and made four consecutive Premier League starts. He was praised for his performances in those games, even claiming a goal against Blackburn Rover.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cesc_Fabregas

Point is, Cesc Fabregas graduated from Arsene Wenger's school!

d) Ashley Cole -

Ashley Cole (born 20 December 1980) is an English footballer, who plays for Chelsea and the England national team. Cole is considered by many critics and fellow professional players as one of the best defenders of his generation,[3][4][5][6] and by some, for the better part of his career, as the best left back in the world.[7][8][9] Born in Stepney, London, Cole began his youth career at Arsenal and made his full debut for the club in November 1999, going on to make a further 228 appearances, scoring nine goals. With Arsenal he won two Premier League titles, three FA Cups, and was an integral member of "The Invincibles" team of the 2003–04 season, who went the entire league season undefeated. Cole also made an appearance in Arsenal's first UEFA Champions League final in 2006.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashley_Cole

e) Theo Walcott -

Arsenal
2005–06 season

Walcott transferred to Arsenal on 20 January 2006, for a fee of £5 million, rising to £12 million depending on appearances for club and country.[10][11] The original fee was payable by instalments – £5 million down, £5 million based on club appearances and £2 million based on England appearances – but was revised to a total of £9.1 million by a compromise settlement agreed on 31 March 2008.[12] He signed an initial pre-contract agreement to sign a professional contract on his 17th birthday on 16 March 2006, and was given the number 32 shirt in the process.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_Walcott

Each of those mentioned are not insignificant players. All grew and graduated at the feet of MASTER TEACHER Arsene Wenger. ...and I could go on and on and on...even as there is recognition that the next lot of great players are being groomed.

Potential is one thing. We are all born with great potential. But being guided and taught to maximize on that potential is an entirely other thing. Arsene Wenger has been excellent motivator and teacher.

[Karl]

Really Warlord? Fabergas was 16 when he started with Wenger, Parlour as well, Viera 20 and played mostly in Milan's reserves before Wenger got him - that's the "finished product"? And which manager can only bring youths? Did you even know who Aaron Ramsey was before Wenger? Ashley Cole? Theo Walcott? Ox? Wilshire? Give credit where it is due. For anyone who looks at the facts, Wenger is a magician who has managed to remain in the top 4 for all of his seasons in charge despite a relatively MEAGER cash outlay. I believe I read somewhere that his average net spend per year in the time he has been at Arsenal was something like £3m. If that is true, that is nothing short of frigging amazing. That's a number you'd expect from Scunthorpe, not a top 4 club.

Tenk yuh, sah!
If I had seen this earlier I would not have made my reply with the Wikipedia quotes.

Respek, Mass Paul!