Difference between Nosworthy and McCleary?

[Mosiah]

First, let me state, I'm not sure McCleary's story, so maybe I should have named another baller.

But when I asked Paul Marin that question, the point I was making, and I have made this a zillion times, is - I have a serious problem with those players who are only ready to join the Boyz when all other options have failed them.

It seems like, no matter how much Karl tries to drill it into us, we fail to appreciate how important it is for us to develop TEAM WORK! Football is a team sport and having players, many of very dubious qualities, feel they can walk into the Reggae Boyz side at any time because they play in England is absolutely crap. Recall that Nyron never look so hot the first few times he played for the Boyz!

Now, one could say Nyron was 32 years old, so it's an easy decision for him. Perhaps! But some of these rucks who are holding out, either for that England call that will never come, or waiting to see how far the Boyz will reach, or waiting to see which of their fellow blokes have joined, those are the ones who should not even bother. No one should have to climb up family trees, knock at doors, and beg you to play for the Boyz. That's a recipe for disaster.

Stoni justified this behaviour because he thought we should do whatever it takes to get ballas who had that snow discipline and determination.

So recognise that there are different ideas here. Just so happens that these last minute ballas all were supposed to have this snow steel. They are really the same thing as what we used to call UB40s. That term referred to those Jamaican footballers who were born and raised in England. Snow ballas refers to the same thing, only that we now realise why it is they are supposed to be better than the garrison hardened ballas like Rudolph Austin.

And lastly, you may recall I had no problem with Raheem Sterling holding out on us. At the time, he was England's brightest hope. It would have been silly to not give England serious consideration. Having said that, it would not have idiotic to decide to play for the Boyz either! But when some rux...ah bwoy!

[Karl]

Glad you put all the blame (of selection) on the JFF.
The nonsense is the calling of these players only when qualifiers commence.

Look - If the player is good enough to be called...call him. You then know whether or not he fits within national team plans as option going forward.

E.g. We are now in a rebuilding process were TEAM Reggae Boyz is concerned...at this time the JFF must make its selections as it looks towards improving the TEAM. Best available players...NOW!

The JFF then knows based on player circumstance 'who is with us'!

Not with us?
No problem...that is 'your right'.
Next!

...and if you are 'with us' today no guarantees you will be called tomorrow.
Why? ...or... How so?

We are building TEAM...BEST TEAM...and tomorrow you may not have keep sufficient form to be more deserving than another 'available player'.
Remember we are building BEST TEAM REGGAEBOYZ.

If you wish to be invited then please be sure your are deserving of your place on quality play!!! Thank you.

[Rockman]

Regarding automatic starters both enjoyed the otherwise privilege.After the fact,it is clear only Nyron justified.....,hence the selection process is suspect(Nyron distinguished himself given the same dynamics).It is aggrandized given the Mc Clearly situation is repeated for most of the snowballers featured,and it has proven to fail....

[Assasin]

The fact is Nugsby should have been called about 5 years ago. When he clearly stated Jamaica was the only team he wanted to represent and he was doing well in the EPL but I can remember many on the forum a call the man rux and how Claude and Stew Peas was better than him.

The fact is our coaches has a wide range of players to select from. Players in the Nordic, players in Jamaica, players in England, players in Vietnam, players in MLS, players and other places.

The Coaches need to do the right thing and pick the right players and lead. Burrell and the JFF is short in many ways and they or many of the people in the JFF can't provide a football vision therefore we need a coach to take care of that and put it on his shoulder and spread it to his team. The fact is Burrell and team know nothing about FOOTBALL and what the hell is the technical committee. Where are they and why is no one resigning??? They should have gone for this.

We can talk about people but not sure how many wanted to represent us. Do you know if Mcleary asked much earlier??? Remember we just wake up and go a England and come back with how many ballers? Why could we have gradually get them in or gone a year before and had some camps. Why is it almost every game we played in qualifers we had players making debut or hasn't played for Jamaica in a long time???

[Karl]

The fact is Nugsby should have been called about 5 years ago. When he clearly stated Jamaica was the only team he wanted to represent and he was doing well in the EPL but I can remember many on the forum a call the man rux and how Claude and Stew Peas was better than him.

The fact is our coaches has a wide range of players to select from. Players in the Nordic, players in Jamaica, players in England, players in Vietnam, players in MLS, players and other places.

The Coaches need to do the right thing and pick the right players and lead. Burrell and the JFF is short in many ways and they or many of the people in the JFF can't provide a football vision therefore we need a coach to take care of that and put it on his shoulder and spread it to his team. The fact is Burrell and team know nothing about FOOTBALL and what the hell is the technical committee. Where are they and why is no one resigning??? They should have gone for this.

We can talk about people but not sure how many wanted to represent us. Do you know if Mcleary asked much earlier??? Remember we just wake up and go a England and come back with how many ballers? Why could we have gradually get them in or gone a year before and had some camps. Why is it almost every game we played in qualifers we had players making debut or hasn't played for Jamaica in a long time???

Yuh seit!
JFF 'policy' is crap! ...and it got us crap results!

Mi used tuh seh wi bad gainst CFU TEAMs but poor against top CONCACAF TEAMs. Luk lacka mi soon aguh affi seh wi struggle gainst CFU teams

[Paul Marin]

I have a serious problem with those players who are only ready to join the Boyz when all other options have failed them.

Mo - this is not an issue you should be getting bent out of shape about. It happens the world over with players of multi-national heritage. More to the point, the players have to operate in their own best interests and the fact that they pick us last is because we are the worst option. Is that their fault? It seems to me - like with any football team (e.g. teams in the prem) - unless the "club" (in our case country) is worthwhile, why play for them if you have better options or believe there are better options? Simply put, it is the nature of football.

We fail to appreciate how important it is for us to develop TEAM WORK! Football is a team sport and having players, many of very dubious qualities, feel they can walk into the Reggae Boyz side at any time because they play in England is absolutely crap...some of these rucks who are holding out, either for that England call that will never come, or waiting to see how far the Boyz will reach, or waiting to see which of their fellow blokes have joined, those are the ones who should not even bother. No one should have to climb up family trees, knock at doors, and beg you to play for the Boyz. That's a recipe for disaster.

Two things:
1. I am not sure of the connection between teamwork and the sentiments of the players you are lambasting.
2. I don't know of a single player on any team who picks himself. It seems to me that the problem is not with the players, but with the administration.

Just so happens that these last minute ballas all were supposed to have this snow steel. They are really the same thing as what we used to call UB40s. That term referred to those Jamaican footballers who were born and raised in England. Snow ballas refers to the same thing, only that we now realise why it is they are supposed to be better than the garrison hardened ballas like Rudolph Austin.

Who said they were supposed to have this "snow steel"? I think if you look deeper the players are not the ones who did that. Secondly, the UB40s actually DID help us get to the 1998 World Cup and demonstrated a greater degree of professionalism than (let me not open the flood gates by mentioning names) some of the home grown talent. And finally, how many Austins do we really have? Seriously?

You may recall I had no problem with Raheem Sterling holding out on us. At the time, he was England's brightest hope. It would have been silly to not give England serious consideration. Having said that, it would not have idiotic to decide to play for the Boyz either!

I'm sorry Mo, but it would have been IDIOTIC for Sterling to join the boyz. He is 18 with possibly 4 world cups in front of him - do you really believe that playing for the boyz would have been smart? Maybe if he was 26 I could accept that, but not when he has a chance to play for a consistent WC qualifying team.

===============================

My two cents:

1. Players are not the issue - they can't pick themselves onto the squad, they can't choose the line up, they can't instill a team regimen, that is the job of the program administrators (TD etc.)

2. Our objective should be to have the broadest widest pool of talent we possibly can - from wherever they reside on the planet

3. We need to develop a clear vision framework that a) sets attainable targets for home grown development, b) holds people accountable and c) institutes a clear, unambiguous expectations of our coaches, youths and administrators at each level if they wish to be part of the national framework.

Simply put - snow ballas are not the problem, it is the breadfruit-head paper pushers that need to be removed. They have to go and be replaced by an entirely new set of people who know how to run an organization larger than a patty-shop (or bakery).

[Karl]

Mo - this is not an issue you should be getting bent out of shape about. It happens the world over with players of multi-national heritage. More to the point, the players have to operate in their own best interests and the fact that they pick us last is because we are the worst option. Is that their fault? It seems to me - like with any football team (e.g. teams in the prem) - unless the "club" (in our case country) is worthwhile, why play for them if you have better options or believe there are better options? Simply put, it is the nature of football.



Two things:
1. I am not sure of the connection between teamwork and the sentiments of the players you are lambasting.
2. I don't know of a single player on any team who picks himself. It seems to me that the problem is not with the players, but with the administration.



Who said they were supposed to have this "snow steel"? I think if you look deeper the players are not the ones who did that. Secondly, the UB40s actually DID help us get to the 1998 World Cup and demonstrated a greater degree of professionalism than (let me not open the flood gates by mentioning names) some of the home grown talent. And finally, how many Austins do we really have? Seriously?



I'm sorry Mo, but it would have been IDIOTIC for Sterling to join the boyz. He is 18 with possibly 4 world cups in front of him - do you really believe that playing for the boyz would have been smart? Maybe if he was 26 I could accept that, but not when he has a chance to play for a consistent WC qualifying team.

===============================

My two cents:

1. Players are not the issue - they can't pick themselves onto the squad, they can't choose the line up, they can't instill a team regimen, that is the job of the program administrators (TD etc.)

2. Our objective should be to have the broadest widest pool of talent we possibly can - from wherever they reside on the planet

3. We need to develop a clear vision framework that sets attainable targets for home grown development, hold people accountable and institutes a clear and unambiguous level of expectations of our coaches, youths and administrators at each level if they wish to be part of the national frame work...

Simply put - snow ballas are not the problem, it is the breadfruit-head paper pushers that need to be removed. They have to go and be replaced by an entirely new set of people.

Talent Abounds!
...but what the hell use is having talent if you are not even exposed to the area within which your talent would bloom

[Mosiah]

I'm sorry Mo, but it would have been IDIOTIC for Sterling to join the boyz. He is 18 with possibly 4 world cups in front of him - do you really believe that playing for the boyz would have been smart? Maybe if he was 26 I could accept that, but not when he has a chance to play for a consistent WC qualifying team.

Aren't we agreeing here, for the most part?!?!

[Paul Marin]

Aren't we agreeing here, for the most part?!?!

Actually, unless I am misreading what you're saying, I don't thinks so. here's why; you had said:

I had no problem with Raheem Sterling holding out on us...Having said that, it would not have [been] idiotic to decide to play for the Boyz either!

==> to which I replied...

I'm sorry Mo, but it would have been IDIOTIC for Sterling to join the boyz. He is 18 with possibly 4 world cups in front of him - do you really believe that playing for the boyz would have been smart? Maybe if he was 26 I could accept that, but not when he has a chance to play for a consistent WC qualifying team.

So basically, even if England had not selected him, it would have made no sense for him to play for us being so young as we don't qualify for anything and his career would falter.

[Rockman]

Sterling playing for us increases our chances of qualifying.EPL clubs are not exactly head over heels for English players.Sterling having a looong,prosperous career at Liverpool is not guaranteed ,Pool will bench him for better.Nani,even though he is from intriguing Portugal, is benched for Valencia.If Sterling is pivotal in making the Boyz reach higher heights,his career at Pool would not miss a beat.Sterling inclusion may even encourage other Yard players eligible to play for elsewhere to choose the Boyz.
Sterling not choosing to represent the Boyz will always leave a bitter taste in my mouth.
A sure way of circumventing Jamaica prowess in track and field is to have the athletes decide whether running for the US makes more sense.

[Mosiah]

Thank you, Rockman. And we could develop that scenario even further. Sterling could reach major heights in Jamaica where he could only dream of in the UK.

[Assasin]

Is that really the case when we would call him every 4 years right before qualifiers?

[Paul Marin]

Sterling playing for us increases our chances of qualifying.EPL clubs are not exactly head over heels for English players.Sterling having a looong,prosperous career at Liverpool is not guaranteed ,Pool will bench him for better.Nani,even though he is from intriguing Portugal, is benched for Valencia.If Sterling is pivotal in making the Boyz reach higher heights,his career at Pool would not miss a beat.Sterling inclusion may even encourage other Yard players eligible to play for elsewhere to choose the Boyz.
Sterling not choosing to represent the Boyz will always leave a bitter taste in my mouth.
A sure way of circumventing Jamaica prowess in track and field is to have the athletes decide whether running for the US makes more sense.

Sorry - but you are delusional. It is NOT the players job to "increase our chance of qualifying". That is an ADMINISTRATIVE function. Players don't select themselves, they don't create strategy, they don't implement tactics. Said another way, it is up to the leadership to create the environment required to attract the players needed to consistently compete at the highest levels. No player (even the truly exceptional which Sterling is not) can be expected to do that. Look to where the problem lies and respect each player's choice. If we have a good program, they will come...but don't expect good players to bet their careers on an administration that doesn't know its foot from is arse.

[Paul Marin]

Thank you, Rockman. And we could develop that scenario even further. Sterling could reach major heights in Jamaica where he could only dream of in the UK.

Before I jump to any conclusions, please explain what heights are you talking about?

[Don1]

Before I jump to any conclusions, please explain what heights are you talking about?

Could it be the possibility of becoming a national icon in one of the world's most powerful & influential national brands??

That's done wonders for quite a few sports persons, musicians etc from Jamaica

In contrast John Barnes did well for England...today he is a somewhat blighted shell... not given much regard by the powers that be in that country