HIGH SCHOOLS as an important part of Jamaica's

[USAF]

National Football Program.

Looking at this from the outside I'm finding it hard to see how this will work, especially with the complete lack of resources.
* You have over 100 high schools competing in 3 age group tournaments & each one will need:
- QUALIFIED head coaches & assistants; equipment managers; medical personnel; grounds keepers; dieticians & chefs.
- PROPER facilities: Playing & training fields; training rooms & equipment; kitchen & dorms.

QUESTIONS:
1. Are the schools WILLING & ABLE to take on all these additional expenses???
2. Even if the schools pay the personnel, the JFF also have an obligation to pay them as employees of the program. Does the JFF have the finances to pay ALL these people???
3. After making this investment, are the schools willing to part with these players (during the high school competition) for non-FIFA tournaments & tours???
4. Since the players will be involved in more intense level of training & development are the schools willing to change the academic schedules???

[Don1]

National Football Program.

Looking at this from the outside I'm finding it hard to see how this will work, especially with the complete lack of resources.
* You have over 100 high schools competing in 3 age group tournaments & each one will need:
- QUALIFIED head coaches & assistants; equipment managers; medical personnel; grounds keepers; dieticians & chefs.
- PROPER facilities: Playing & training fields; training rooms & equipment; kitchen & dorms.

QUESTIONS:
1. Are the schools WILLING & ABLE to take on all these additional expenses???
2. Even if the schools pay the personnel, the JFF also have an obligation to pay them as employees of the program. Does the JFF have the finances to pay ALL these people???
3. After making this investment, are the schools willing to part with these players (during the high school competition) for non-FIFA tournaments & tours???
4. Since the players will be involved in more intense level of training & development are the schools willing to change the academic schedules???

You're right ... that cannot work. Too elaborate and expensive. These are foreign concepts. There is NOTHING in Jamaican sport that resembles this. Jamaica operates sport organizations on a largely volunteer basis.

That volunteer/cooperative mode is the way in track for example that Jamaica beats the World

In football it is unfortunate that the 100 year old high school competition is the MOST ORGANIZED and respected system...by default of the football administrators.

Fortunately there are many other ways to skin this particular football puss

[USAF]

Would like to see how you have the schools be an IMPORTANT part of your National Football Program in a less "elaborate & expensive" way???........as long as your explanation is not like one of Karl's "thesis".

[Don1]

Don1 nuh deal wid explanations...mi deal wid systems

The piece of the puzzle missing here (because I'm ONLY dealing with HS level) is the 7-12 cohort...smaddy else cyan deal wid dat

Don1
Reggae Prime Minister

A simple plan to improve U-17 & U-20 football

The JFF, ISSA and the ministries of sport & education need to cooperate to ensure that kids in the national program both get a sound academic education...and learn to play team ball.

1. Form a permanent national player pool at U-17 and U-20 levels based at the Academy -- World Cup Development -- WCD program.... players evaluated and selected islandwide

2. With assistance from ISSA & Min of Education, recruit say 10 willing & suitable schools in easy reach of UWI to serve as "home" schools for the student athletes in the pools. Rural players can be transferred to one of these schools...players in the KMR can remain in their current schools.... suitable accommodation for out of towners to be provided.

WCD players will not be available to the schools for their competitions but only for the Academy program...the schools will just be responsible for their academic development in all aspects. Tutors to be provided for students needing remedial work

3. Training at the Academy to be structured around the school schedule... transportation to and from the academy (and any accommodation expenses) to be arranged by the JFF/Chase Fund/sponsors

4. If feasible/desirable.. enter the U-17 team in the club U-20 competition and the U-20 in the KSAFA Major League...or competition deemed most suitable for their age group & development.
Otherwise proceed with whatever development program is suitable for competitive games...

5. JFF & ISSA to cooperate to build coaching & player development expertise in the high schools and their competitions
__________________

[Karl]

...but we have to start somewhere and move towards increasingly more efficiency...so here goes...

HIGH SCHOOLS as an important part of Jamaica's

National Football Program.

Looking at this from the outside I'm finding it hard to see how this will work, especially with the complete lack of resources.
* You have over 100 high schools competing in 3 age group tournaments & each one will need:
- QUALIFIED head coaches & assistants; equipment managers; medical personnel; grounds keepers; dieticians & chefs.
- PROPER facilities: Playing & training fields; training rooms & equipment; kitchen & dorms.

QUESTIONS:
1. Are the schools WILLING & ABLE to take on all these additional expenses???
2. Even if the schools pay the personnel, the JFF also have an obligation to pay them as employees of the program. Does the JFF have the finances to pay ALL these people???
3. After making this investment, are the schools willing to part with these players (during the high school competition) for non-FIFA tournaments & tours???
4. Since the players will be involved in more intense level of training & development are the schools willing to change the academic schedules???

I shall answer two ways:
First assumption as you are addressing only HIGH SCHOLLS is:
You are suggesting that there is a proper run football oversight body (JFF) and willing partners at various levels.

...therefore I am answering on the assumption that High Schools would be merely highest school rung on the ladder of comprehensive development pyramid. Therefore when the kids arrive in the high schools they will have already had some formal age appropriate introduction to the game.

A.
1. - It would mean two things - a) schools using current resources more efficiently as they already have the human capital (just under-used and terribly mismanaged) and the physical plants (also mismanaged).

2. JFF would just have to better manage its resources and use same to teach/train and upgrade the school's personal in technical areas of coaching and physical fitness preparation.

Other technical areas e.g. medical doctors & dentists, physical therapists, nutritionists, etc. will provide service through volunteerism and financial assisted programs (e.g. parents/guardians, past students and fund raising activities). We have a vast network of same used for supporting other sports programs.

3. Relative few students will be required for tours and international matches.
Those who travel and tour would be no different than those of our other sports who travel for matches.

There would be relatively few matches further than the US mainland...save during our 'schools' holidays'. ...when there would be no impediment to touring period...inclusive of traveling longer distances.

Very important - Full advantage would have to be taken of the vast number of quality national teams, academies and other entitles invited to visit - stand alone visits, local arranged tournaments e.g. 2 visiting clubs academies and 1 or 2 local teams or any combination as appropriate. (The vast numbers of quality stand alone academies, quality clubs' age appropriate teams, national teams across the football world...suggests an overabundance of that type set of resources).

Just takes organization and managment skills to adequately take care of those tours and travel match schedules.

No adjustment to current curriculum needed. In Jamaica most training exercises for national teams or 'best of the best' players should be late evenings or early mornings when it is several degrees cooler. ...and there is our 'school's out days and 'holidays'.

B.
Now we substitute "Track and Field" for "Football".

National Track and Field Program.

Looking at this from the outside I'm finding it hard to see how this will work, especially with the complete lack of resources.
* You have over 100 high schools competing in 3 age group tournaments & each one will need:
- QUALIFIED head coaches & assistants; equipment managers; medical personnel; grounds keepers; dieticians & chefs.
- PROPER facilities: Playing & training fields; training rooms & equipment; kitchen & dorms.



QUESTIONS:
1. Are the schools WILLING & ABLE to take on all these additional expenses???
2. Even if the schools pay the personnel, the JFF also have an obligation to pay them as employees of the program. Does the JFF have the finances to pay ALL these people???
3. After making this investment, are the schools willing to part with these players (during the high school competition) for non-FIFA tournaments & tours???
4. Since the players will be involved in more intense level of training & development are the schools willing to change the academic schedules???

OK! .....B:
* You have over 100 high schools competing in 3 age group appropriate meets - under the umbrella of friendly pre-Champs interaction...sectional tournaments - Gibson Relays, Eastern Champs, Western Champs & each one with:
- QUALIFIED head coaches & assistants; equipment managers; medical personnel; grounds keepers; dieticians & chefs...ETC., ETC.
- PROPER facilities: Playing & training fields; training rooms & equipment; kitchen & dorms or living off campus.

QUESTIONS:
1. The are schools WILLING & ABLE to take on all these additional expenses!!!! They have been doing that for some time.

2. The schools manage to pay the personnel, the ISSA has an obligation...and distributes some of its income to each school.

Each school manages it own affairs and form associations to manage 'friendly meets' ...in my days we had such friendly 'Track meets' as with KC - a dual meet; Cornwall College - a dual meet and the sectional meets - Western Champs and the all-island, Champs. There was also a local - held in Jamaica - meet with Trinidad...and just after I left it was expanded to include Barbados...either one week or two week overseas visit. I think the current CARIFTA GAMES meet is the outgrowth of those earlier meets.

...and there was then introduction of visits to the PENN Relays...and some schools are now going to a meet in Miami, I think?

Of course now there is the additional World Junior games...

3. On making the investment, the schools have been allowing their players (athletes) time to travel.

4. Since the players will be involved in more intense level of training & development are the schools willing to change the academic schedules???

See above on training in cooler time of day.
Maybe...School's day end - break - prep/homework - training - rest (10:00pm to 6:00am?)...in any case, just work out/manage time...

A start?
...that statement on and about "we have no resources" I am thinking is really saying, there are resources we just cannot see... right?

A start? ...we must start right?

We cannot wait for 'the perfect scenario"... right?

A start must be made...right?

[Don1]

1. The are schools WILLING & ABLE to take on all these additional expenses!!!! They have been doing that for some time.

2. The schools manage to pay the personnel, the ISSA has an obligation...and distributes some of its income to each school.

Sorry...but this is completely unrealistic. The tiny handful of schools which MAY be able to get alumni or sponsors to help defray the cost of a NATIONAL program which happens to use their students or facilities would NOT be willing to take this on....there is little capacity and zero incentive for our overburdened schools to put more money into a sport in that way.

It's unrealistic to expect schools to actually spend significantly more money on sport

Also... I doubt ISSA has money to distribute to schools either .... yuh tink ISSA name FIFA??

The role of the schools in a national program is to provide education for the kids in the program and receive technical help to upgrade their coaching and their ability to play consistent with some national ball philosophy

[Bricktop]

You totally miss the point...each school is not going to develop 10-15 top players...the point is for the best to play with/against the best...in your model the best will be playing with/against mediocre talent...

[USAF]

What you have outlined is feasible & practical - Having an academy to develop "elite" players for the national teams & the high schools to provide the academics (although I think you should start from U13), BUT what I was addressing was the notion by posters like Karl who think that the schools can & should be used to develop "elite" players for the national program.

[Don1]

What you have outlined is feasible & practical - Having an academy to develop "elite" players for the national teams & the high schools to provide the academics (although I think you should start from U13), BUT what I was addressing was the notion by posters like Karl who think that the schools can & should be used to develop "elite" players for the national program.

If Karl or someone else posted that... I don't agree

[Karl]

You totally miss the point...each school is not going to develop 10-15 top players...the point is for the best to play with/against the best...in your model the best will be playing with/against mediocre talent...

USAF asks about HIGH SCHOOLS and then you claim I am or have once suggested that the HIGH SCHOOLS be the alpha and omega of development or is the national program????

A wah di hell mi a deal wid pure mad people???

Just to remind USAF, Don1 and Bricktop of the questions asked and the context within asked -

HIGH SCHOOLS as an important part of Jamaica's
National Football Program.

Looking at this from the outside I'm finding it hard to see how this will work, especially with the complete lack of resources.
* You have over 100 high schools competing in 3 age group tournaments & each one will need:
- QUALIFIED head coaches & assistants; equipment managers; medical personnel; grounds keepers; dieticians & chefs.
- PROPER facilities: Playing & training fields; training rooms & equipment; kitchen & dorms.

QUESTIONS:
1. Are the schools WILLING & ABLE to take on all these additional expenses???
2. Even if the schools pay the personnel, the JFF also have an obligation to pay them as employees of the program. Does the JFF have the finances to pay ALL these people???
3. After making this investment, are the schools willing to part with these players (during the high school competition) for non-FIFA tournaments & tours???
4. Since the players will be involved in more intense level of training & development are the schools willing to change the academic schedules???

...and the context of my response -

shall answer two ways:
First assumption as you are addressing only HIGH SCHOLLS is:
You are suggesting that there is a proper run football oversight body (JFF) and willing partners at various levels.

...therefore I am answering on the assumption that High Schools would be merely highest school rung on the ladder of comprehensive development pyramid. Therefore when the kids arrive in the high schools they will have already had some formal age appropriate introduction to the game.

How have you guys jumped to:
a) the alpha and omega of a nonsense statement like: USAF's - Karl who think that the schools can & should be used to develop "elite" players for the national program;

b) Bricktop's equally ridiculous, each school is not going to develop 10-15 top players...the point is for the best to play with/against the best...in your model the best will be playing with/against mediocre talent...

Bricktop should explain why he believes or has implied that each HIGH school should produce 10 -15 top players and the period within which that should occur and at what age-group or age-groups? ...and how such a response relates to USAF's question

HIGH SCHOOLS as an important part of Jamaica's National Football Program?

...and his follow up questions?

c) Finally - Is it USAF has forgotten his question - HIGH SCHOOLS as an important part of Jamaica's National Football Program?

Aside: In light of USAF's initial thread and question, it is interesting how Don1 responds to USAF's claim -
Quote: If Karl or someone else posted that... I don't agree End of Quote!

Clever answer...and that (smiling face)at the end is the killer!

[Karl]

Sorry...but this is completely unrealistic. The tiny handful of schools which MAY be able to get alumni or sponsors to help defray the cost of a NATIONAL program which happens to use their students or facilities would NOT be willing to take this on....there is little capacity and zero incentive for our overburdened schools to put more money into a sport in that way.

It's unrealistic to expect schools to actually spend significantly more money on sport

Also... I doubt ISSA has money to distribute to schools either .... yuh tink ISSA name FIFA??

The role of the schools in a national program is to provide education for the kids in the program and receive technical help to upgrade their coaching and their ability to play consistent with some national ball philosophy

You cannot just jump to schools when the question posed is specific to HIGH SCHOOLS. Running off at a tangent just will not do.

You go on to reference ISSA as not being able to make a contribution to each high school. As fact, ISSA already do make a contribution to each high school (through its sponsors and from its gate receipts). ...and each high school already raises funds through the sources named. It would be merely hiring the qualified professionals to ramp up sourcing of funding.

The professionals always do a better job that the non-professionals. Although for some reason ISSA and the PCLA year after year...for too many years stumble along on their own as they take the 'Jamaica path' of
by-passing the professionals while delighting in sub-par efforts of bringing sponsors onboard and raising funds.

Thank God, Bolt and Racers ignored that 'Jamaica mold' and went the professionals' way.

Finally: The High Schools must each spend more across all departments/areas...inclusive of across all disciplines. It must be done to bring us to acceptable levels of performances. The only real question is, how swiftly will those responsible for ensuring same 'get up off their arses' and do same.

Fact is, all the administrators who are steeped in the 'can't do' mode should go...kicked out as fast as possible. The high schools have problems of inadequate funding...poor quality delivery of services that must be solved.
No excuses...just do it. That is their jobs!!!!

[Jawge]

So Karl; what about the other 800 hundred odd students? They should suffer because the high schools across Ja is trying to pick a squad of 24? High school is not the place anymore for the kid the dreams of being a computer scientists, a writer, a historian and an economist (to name a few)?

Academics should take a back seat to soccer because that's the only way you can see Ja competing at the INT'L level? What about Ja's economy and the advancement of human capital in the info age?

[Bricktop]

Bricktop should explain why he believes or has implied that each HIGH school should produce 10 -15 top players

How else will the best play with/against the best?

[Don1]

=Karl;444119]You cannot just jump to schools when the question posed is specific to HIGH SCHOOLS. Running off at a tangent just will not do.

ok but i did mean high schools

You go on to reference ISSA as not being able to make a contribution to each high school. As fact, ISSA already do make a contribution to each high school (through its sponsors and from its gate receipts). ...and each high school already raises funds through the sources named. It would be merely hiring the qualified professionals to ramp up sourcing of funding.

Ok the competition sponsors do contribute gear etc to schools which helps defray costs.... it's debatable whether we can say that's ISSA's contribution as well but I'll grant you that

As to gate receipts...definitely no. ISSA has virtually no gate receipts except possibly when the HS competition is at playoff stage.... I doubt schools see that money.
Regular season games are at school grounds and are generally free I believe tho some schools ask for a "donation" at the gate...
So when the games @ school grounds aren't free.. that has nothing to do with ISSA

The professionals always do a better job that the non-professionals. Although for some reason ISSA and the PCLA year after year...for too many years stumble along on their own as they take the 'Jamaica path' of
by-passing the professionals while delighting in sub-par efforts of bringing sponsors onboard and raising funds.

Thank God, Bolt and Racers ignored that 'Jamaica mold' and went the professionals' way.

ok

Finally: The High Schools must each spend more across all departments/areas...inclusive of across all disciplines. It must be done to bring us to acceptable levels of performances. The only real question is, how swiftly will those responsible for ensuring same 'get up off their arses' and do same.

This is a pie in the sky. If schools are able to access significantly more funding.... this should largely be directed to academic improvement... not sports

Fact is, all the administrators who are steeped in the 'can't do' mode should go...kicked out as fast as possible. The high schools have problems of inadequate funding...poor quality delivery of services that must be solved.
No excuses...just do it. That is their jobs!!!!

That approach works for Nike... not so much for the typical Jamaican high school. Mi tink yuh ah nyam seedless grapes too long

[Gamma]

i often wonder if karl himself sometimes believes what he thinks he is trying to say ....