Bundlesliga play and thoughts on total defense!

[Stonigut]

Funny thing this fancy foot ball thing, I have been involved with coaching a local select team and this bug is very much evident here as well, there are a few players who just cannot touch the ball without testing a few brick boo moves maybe is just a male ego thing.

[Sir X]

I will make it short , did Real and Barca loose the game in defence or tactical coaching errors ?

Real & Barca lost in the middle and offence , the goals scored against them was a culmination of pressure from attack to midfielfd on their midfield and defence.The truth is they didnt trouble Dortmund or Bayern from an offensive point , so that should tell you tactical errors were made in that midfield department, I gaurantee you the rematch will be different.

A defence starts with an offence ,thats not to say you dont or neglect a strong defensive foundation in the backline but it starts up front, ball possesion the tactical defensive word, isnt limited to the bcak four, more so its the responsibility of the midfield (ball possesioin).

And thats what Dormund and Bayern beat them with that defensive game of ball possesion in the midfield , to stretch the field clog the middle and distribute the ball decisively on the counter.

It will be a midfield war when they meet again (ball possesion) and whomever wins that will more than likely win the game, based on the % of ball possesion.

[Stonigut]

X ball possession is a good thing if you can do it, jamaica cannot possess the ball against superior opposition like in the hex, so you take what is given to you and play lock down clog the field ball. When we can give good training to the youths and develop a consistent program we can play possession ball, believe me we have no clue how to play that. It will take twenty years of consistent development of Jamaican football to get there.

[Sir X]

I got you , here comes the knock out punch.

jamaica cannot possess the ball against superior opposition like in the hex

Superior ..panama , c. rica , honduras , mex ? ...we have beaten all of them and got beaten by all of them, so you start your tactical analysis from a position of weakness, that explains your fixation with defence , you see no point in trying to attack , you plan to draw your way to brazil or hoof it up , hoping that it connects and we score.The debate is over for me , you have been Xposed.You have basically written off our midfield , your tactical ploy is 16 years old.

Roy Hodgson/Rene Simoes..101

[Stonigut]

Hehehaha, if you were a lawyer you would be broke! That is not even an argument. This is not a debate this is reasoning to show you the truth, now I understand you a little more, it is not a personal thing.

It is not what you have done in the past it's where you are, we are at the bottom of the pack and we have tried the attack thing against pan at home and got exposed and we have tried it in cr and got worse exposed. The hex is going to be decided by who makes the least mistakes and who can capitalize on the others mistakes. That is it. Jam the mids, solid defense and transition and counter attack game, that is the best we can do now. When the rest of concacaf saw the game we played against mex they all trembled in their boots, as a disciplined, superior execution and tactically aware jamaica with our athletes is a formidable combination, attack ball and try to play possession ball is justanother variation of the calypso caribbean mentality that we need to shed fast, what you and many are calling for we cannot play that kind of ball we don't have the players or team culture to do it against these types of teams.

[Sir X]

This is not a debate this is reasoning to show you the truth

So we drew with Mex, almost beating them in the Azetca with only playing defence ? Ryan Johnson played what part in the midfield , if it wasnt for his tracking back and helping out , Mex would have probably swamped us , That and all the other midfierders showing up, we got it tactically right in that game , with a few adjustments (subs) we could have won.What happened to that team against Panama and C.Rica , did our defence overnight get weak , or was there other glaring variables shuffled , like our forward line and midfield? The biggest change post MEX was our forward line and midfield .

But as you say , its not a debate, and your response only shows how ridiculous your propositions are.

You can only laugh and i am laughing too ,not with you but at you.You seem to be talking outta both sides of you mouth. What are you saying concacaf trembling when they watched us play the worst ball possesion game against MEX and we should have lost ?..lol

KMT.

[Stonigut]

Ok you win, I am ridiculous and you are all wise!

[Sir X]

I win ? no I made my point , yuh cant have it both ways , our defence cant be rock be solid one game and ruckish the next and you absolve the midfield and forward line and in the same tone talk about ball control and transition .

Yuh will end up in circles talking outta yuh.....

[Stonigut]

You will actually start making points when you are actually having a discussion, in your blind rush to assail and make unnecessary points, it is like you are deaf to one thing I am saying so I concede on that, oh wise one!

Btw Each game that is played is played by a different team, whether it is new players, new instructions or less motivated players. The first game they played exactly what I would advocate, 4-5-1, I said it here that the move to play 4-4-2 and the personnel was a mistake and it was, the same for the cr game again 4-4-2 with two defensive mids and two flank mids leaving a massive gap in the ability to battle in midfield, to effectively counter or to build the ball.

Again the focus is to control midfield space both on the defensive side and the offensive side, on the d side you do that by holding the shape, with five guys in the mid you shut down a lot of space on the flanks and in the middle forcing them to either play very patiently or at a very high level or get frustrated and give away the ball, in any of those scenarios we are clearly forcing the opponent to adjust to our approach, which is always a win. On the offense side with two dm's one central attacking midfielder and two flank mids, you have a lot of options, upon the breakdown of the oppositions attack you can rapidly counter or you can decide to try and hold the ball and try to build the attack via possession and patience, that is not our strong suit, but it can be done at times. Attack must come in multiple forms straightforward or surprise and many variations of that so you can have possession and counter attack in your arsenal at the same time.

[Mosiah]

But the players are not playing Jamaican football!!?!?!?

[Mosiah]

It is not what you have done in the past it's where you are, we are at the bottom of the pack and we have tried the attack thing against pan at home and got exposed...

Really?!? Which game were you watching?!? Or was I watching the wrong game?!?!

[Stonigut]

Mo that is exactly the point, we talked about how we were going to attack, we went 4-4-2 because we figured panama was a team that we could play more of a possession ball game, well that did not happen, they jammed their midfield and we never got control of the game and we were lucky to have not lost that game.

[Mosiah]

I just don't think we went into that game trying to attack, regardless of the formation.