development and Manning and DCup

[Assasin]

I now think Dacosta and Manning cup competition should be an Under 17 competition. There is no reason for Clubs to be fighting with schools and national teams should be fighting with schools.

Most of the major players will be identified and play for their school at 15 year old and up. Some schools will hold back players even after they should have left just to win Dcup or Manning cup. Yes I had young players who came to the states and got into college and their local coach calling them to come back to "win" cup.

In England kids graduate by 16 year old from high school so most of the youngsters can go to pro clubs at that age. As of next year kids have to go to school until 18 so I will how that things there. In the US they graduate by 18 year old but by then most of the kids who are consider "special" are already in the Olympic development program.

At 17 year old our best players should be playing with elite players not against feeble competition and they should be playing competitively for the better part of a year, not two months and should be guided by some of our best coach with one program in mind, not an all star team.

[Mosiah]

That's an idea worth considering.

[Karl]

I now think Dacosta and Manning cup competition should be an Under 17 competition. There is no reason for Clubs to be fighting with schools and national teams should be fighting with schools.

What do you mean about fighting?
Do you know something that we do not?

Most of the major players will be identified and play for their school at 15 year old and up. Some schools will hold back players even after they should have left just to win Dcup or Manning cup. Yes I had young players who came to the states and got into college and their local coach calling them to come back to "win" cup.

What is our player pool?
..and you are suggesting we exclude the vast majority of our 15+ through 19 year olds from our development program.

I think the more sensible route would be to stock all the schools -prep, primary, high schools with world class teachers-coaches and constantly upgrade the quality and the facilites. ...a fairly easy task.

[quote]

In England kids graduate by 16 year old from high school so most of the youngsters can go to pro clubs at that age. [quote]

Most?

As of next year kids have to go to school until 18 so I will how that things there. In the US they graduate by 18 year old but by then most of the kids who are consider "special" are already in the Olympic development program.

My problem with the USA is, in my opinion 'tons' of the very best of their talent are not given a 'look in'. I think the vast majority of the talent is not given a 'look in'.

Certainly if what I saw in Brentwood, Long Island and Coral Spring, Florida (kids of Central American, South American and West Indian ancestry) is anything to go by, the USA is not even looking at its best talent.

Our best players 17 year old should be playing with fellow elite players and those who have the ability against our senior elite players not against feeble competition and they should be playing competitively for the better part of a year, not two months and should be guided by some of our best coaches.

The above I agree with wholeheartedly.

[Assasin]

The fact is kids are been called for the national teams and coaches want them to play DCup and the national program. You and other agents have to wait until these kids finish DCUP even when they are finish 5th form.

Like it or not but DCUP and Manning cup is only competitive in the interzone stages and even then most schools have 3 good players at most. I think some of the 15-19 year old excluded and others don't have good coaching to develop.


I said most meanin those that have potential and want to play football.

Believe it or not the US system works. How many of these youths you talk about have been to the ODP trial??? Many of the better youths are recruited by elite US teams and are in ODP program. You claim the youths are been left out but if you look you will see many youths with caribbean heritage are making it through. How does the Florida ODP program stack up with Califonia and other places??

The fact is meanwhile our players are playing dcup and manning cup for three months others at that age are in serious programs. The last 2 years of DCUP for any good player is a waste of time and not very good for development.

[Jawge]

Glad yuh seeing di light. School boy football is holding back the overall development of the island's game. It wil also keep the JFF permanently in the red (as they have to act as club to develop thse young ones to meet INT'L standards).

Karl is only interested to keep the "tradition" going. This way they could meet over beers and speak of how great a high school was in the 60s up to present (whilst totally disregarding the fact that money is being lost and Ja's game is substandard at the int'l level).

[Karl]

Glad yuh seeing di light. School boy football is holding back the overall development of the island's game. It wil also keep the JFF permanently in the red (as they have to act as club to develop thse young ones to meet INT'L standards).

Karl is only interested to keep the "tradition" going. This way they could meet over beers and speak of how great a high school was in the 60s up to present (whilst totally disregarding the fact that money is being lost and Ja's game is substandard at the int'l level).

Both you and Sass miss the point. Schoolboy football is not to be killed...but improved.

You guys are advocating something similar to not improving schools but closing all schools and putting only elite students in an academy.

A wah dat faada?

[Assasin]

Home am I killing it? I am advocating that players shouldn't be playing football at age when the rest of the world players are looking to go pro.

How many other country that is serious about soccer have their best 19 year old playing in school boy leagues and excluded from playing club soccer. Most players graduate 5th form at 16-17 so why hold them back for 2 years just to play for their school?

[Karl]

Home am I killing it? I am advocating that players shouldn't be playing football at age when the rest of the world players are looking to go pro.

How many other country that is serious about soccer have their best 19 year old playing in school boy leagues and excluded from playing club soccer. Most players graduate 5th form at 16-17 so why hold them back for 2 years just to play for their school?

I though you were advocating academies. ...and nothing for the rest of the island's players.


For development purposes the schoolboy football is better than our club football.

The facilities at the schoolboy level is far superior and the schoolboy squads try to play some semblance of TEAM. ...besides it is the cluture and norm for teachers to be constantly upgrading subject knowledge.
...so you have a tremendous cadre that is already receptive to gaining knowledge and passing it on. ...thus it is easier to organise and expose our schools' physical education teachers and those who teach (coach) the game at the schools into learning the subject matter/going to learn the game and thus being able to go to the 'classrooms'/fields and teach.

Our clubs still play like the English Division 1 of yesteryear - 1 big kick up field and everyone chases around without any reason. ...no appreciation of possession/why the ball must never be given away...no knowledge of the mechanics of kicking a ball...little knowledge of tactics...not a clue on teaching the art of scoring goals...pure unadulterated nonsense keeps happening.

Those at the clubs live and die by the athleticism of our players. That is why we have a DJ leading the team that wins the Premier League. That is why year after year we crash and burn as soon as we play the US and Mexico and have such great problems beating the Central Anerican teams ...not a prayer at beating Mexico and the US when it is a competitive match where qualification for FIFA tournaments is at stake.

The schools as collective unit is our saviour, yet we keep ignoring it.

[1of1]

"The schools as collective unit is our saviour, yet we keep ignoring it."

can't agree wid yuh, schoolboy football may have been the outlet for our talent at an early age but past puberty, god help wi, king of a very small hill.

[Pbanta]

What is holding back football in Jamaica is simple in todays football in and beyond CONCACAF is a correct and organized way to do football education to coaches at all levels and to develop players beyond what is happening at the local level in Jamaica. If one does not what is out side the shores of Jamacia one can't impart this information and pass onto those who so desperatley need it to move football forward.

This effort must be done correctly to the coaches which include methodology beyond what those in CONCACAF countires can offer. Those doing football education in Jamaica are not international trained to bring to the table what could make changes into a country exciting and where more player numbers could develop.

How many center midfields or top forwards or goalkeepers have been deeloped from ages 7/8 through age 17-20 years old. I watcheed one who name is Omar Holness from age 10-16. What a talent and doen with no international coaching exerts to help. Imagine what the player could have been like with good coaching. I know his dad... He use to play for me. This young may be able to play por one day but his chances are slowly being deminished for 2 rreason. Coaching and allot of players at his level to play with. Some one out there would know those numbers better than me or I could be worng.

Trinadad and their FF is now leading this efforts by bringing in international football educators to teach a pool of coaches to move the countries football education forward and make an efforts to caoch better. It will work and you will see in a few years player development. It simply happens. They have not done it right in the past and will in the future making a new effort based on methods outside CONCACAF.

It's not about school boy football or club football or national level football. I find is interesting that the KSAFA youth (go to their website) U13, U15 and U17 is such a short season compared to school football. Why is that ? Player development cannot take place with so few matches in one years on one team and at one age level. Caoches can't develop either. who want to coaches for 10-13 weeks and call that a coached season. God bless everybody out there and pray like never beofre for a better way, becasue there is one and it's not that complicated. Sorry about the lenght here.

Paul Banta
GSM International

[Pbanta]

Correct. This all needs to be sorted out with those who are serious about football development in JAM. At least now groups are meeting and that's at least favorable. Now a long term plan is to be developed and not just a fix here or there.

PBANTA

[Assasin]

Karl this much I know. between the age of 17-19 our youths are wasted. This is when the real talent get separted in most football playing country.

Our schools have no plan. Look at a school like Titchfield which is a traditional football school don't even have a paid coach. It is old student who work with a coach. So many of these schools just have a "man" who use to kick some ball or have an idea.

When I am talking about clubs I am talking about identifying these kids and place them in a program. If you ask me a under 21 team would be in the NPL and a regional under 21 in each CONFED.

I will talk later on this.

[Mosiah]

sigh

not sure the right people are listening.

[Pbanta]

We have spoken to the right folk but have ever heard back for development to be moving forward with football education. This started in 2008. Words are great but action is reality. God bless Jamaica.

C