Obrien White just scored his first MLS goal

[Me]

Please read your own posts. This is getting beyond ridiculous.

[Assasin]

ok I did say push.

read this and see how policies can be changed because of the pressure of sporting organizations and tell me they didn't push it. Please take note of extraordinary ahtlete. While it is only visa don't tell me they can't push for citizenship.

Stay of foreign athletes extended

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Associated Press

WASHINGTON -- The next big Dominican baseball prospect won't face a limit on his playing career in the United States, now that U.S. immigration officials have agreed to let foreign athletes keep playing here as long as they leave the country after 10 years and apply for a new visa.


The change came in a new policy memo issued by U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services, following months of lobbying by sports leagues and lawyers for foreign athletes. The memo, obtained Monday by The Associated Press, also came after the AP made inquiries to the agency about the limit.


The leagues and lawyers had complained that the agency recently began enforcing a 10-year limit, endangering the U.S. careers of foreign athletes. Agency officials countered that they've enforced the limit for years, which is based on a 1990 immigration law.


Foreign athletes participate in pro sports such as baseball, basketball, hockey and golf. They can come to the U.S. and play under what's known as a P-1 visa, which is for internationally recognized athletes or members of internationally recognized entertainment groups.


Under the old regulations, recipients could get five years on the visa, and extend it once for another five years, not to exceed a total of 10 years.


The new policy will require foreign athletes, at the end of 10 years, to leave the country before applying for a new visa. That's not expected to be much of a burden for the athletes, many of whom return to their home country anyway in the offseason.


Agency spokesman Bill Wright said that memo was issued following interest in the policy from sports leagues and the AP.


"There's absolutely no reason why the agency can't clarify the standing policy," Wright said. "It was something that needed to be done."


Major League Baseball and other pro sports were worried that the 10-year limit would put a dent in some of their players' careers, especially those who spend several seasons in the minor leagues. While the sports couldn't point to any athletes who have been kept out because of the policy, they expressed fears that could happen any time.


"This is a very helpful and commonsense change in policy," said MLB executive and lobbyist Lucy Calautti. "For baseball fans, it means knowing that many of their favorite players will be there, each spring, ready to play."


The new policy memo states that P-1 athletes "are not subject to a lifetime admission of 10 years in the United States."


Steve Ladik, a Dallas lawyer who serves as outside immigration counsel to the PGA Tour and represents athletes in various sports, called the change "a fair solution which will accomplish the goal of allowing athletes to spend their entire career competing in the U.S."


In the last session of Congress, MLB pushed legislation by Rep. Linda Sanchez, D-Calif., that would have scrapped the 10-year limit. The bill made it through the House Judiciary Committee but never came up for a vote in the House.


"It is difficult to imagine our sports leagues today without such names as Dirk Nowitzki, Johan Santana, Alex Ovechkin and Vladimir Guerrero, all of whom are foreign citizens," Sanchez wrote in a "Dear Colleague" letter to lawmakers last session.


There were other options for players who had reached the cap, such as applying for a green card or trying for a different type of visa. For example, the AP learned that National Basketball Association star Nowitzki, a Dallas Mavericks forward now in his 11th season, switched to an O-1 visa last year. The O-1 visa is reserved for athletes and others of "extraordinary ability," and the German-born Nowitzki is one the league's top players. But it's not an option for the average professional athlete.

[Me]

As mi seh. All now mi nuh see nuh facts. All mi see is, "if them do it for this, then citizenship ........"

[Assasin]

what facts can you get? Can you show me where immigration show details of cases?

[Me]

I am just like you. I have no facts to support that the US moves citizenship cases along for US soccer players.

[Paul Marin]

I swore to myself I would not get involved in this banter, BUT i also swore I would never get married...now look at me...1 wife and 3 pickney later. So here goes.

I think that both Zeppo and Assassin are talking past each other. Assassin is saying that [anything is possible with lawyer, enough money and the right contacts]. He has not put forward any documentation of policy or practice that can be used as evidence to support his position. That said, I don't think that any country in the world has a stated policy regarding accelerating citizenship for a gifted athlete. I may be wrong on that, but could you imagine a sporting super power like the US having a declared policy on accelerating citizenship for a gifted athlete? It is not like political asylum and would possibly be roundly condemned. That said, it is not like the Ronaldos, Ronaldinhos or Gerrards are clamouring to play footy for the USA, nor would I suspect that many in the State Department would elevate US Soccer to the top of their priority list. That said, I am pretty sure that with the right lawyers, contacts and money, anyone of us can fast track US citizenship.

Now, that's my take on Assassin's position. He can correct me if I am wrong.

In Zeppo's defense, I think he is right. He quite correctly has stated there is no stated policy or any precedent that anyone has brought forward to show that US Soccer can do anything to speed up the process. The only example, the one of Regis, is based on a what I believe from Zeppo's post is a long standing policy that if I recall correctly, Steve Samuel (US Coach at the time) aggressively exploited.

So at the end of the day, like most things, there is some truth to both sides. I do believe that Sass's general position has merit (i.e. with contacts and money anything is possible), but I also believe that there is no concrete example of US Soccer ever going down this path, so he will have to wait for that event for proof, but I think we would all agree that Assassin's position is not far fetched, he just lacks a concrete example. Still, Zeppo has more concrete factual data to support his position, so unless (and until) Sass can put forth a concrete example of the US using contacts, money and lawyers to gain citizenship for a player, Zeppo wins, but only just by a nose. He should do the right thing however, and acknowledge that there is a common sense aspect to what Assassin is saying.

Paul "Judge" Marin

[Assasin]

tunnel vision is a hell of a thing. The US system is so perfect that it can't happen.

I have used the US immigration system and I know what influencial lawyers can do. That saying until a Ronaldo comes along there is no pressure to do anything.

[Me]

And until we see that Ronaldo, that "push" is all speculation.

[Assasin]

what else can it be?

It would be a special case, wouldn't it?

[Zeppo]

Zeppo wins, but only just by a nose.

So how much are you awarding me in this settlement, Judge?

[Paul Marin]

You have to do 2 weeks community service (better than the 2 weeks and 1 day that Sass has to serve). Any argument and I will increase it to 3 weeks and it is all predicated on you giving Sass some due...otherwise...you will be in contempt and you will be going to jail. And you know what happens in jail.