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Actually, Barcelona Have Done Us No Favours
Firstly, well done Barcelona, absolutely flawless, the most skilful team in the world at the moment. Messi is not just the best player, he is the best player I have seen since Maradona for natural skill.
I thought Liverpool's worst result of the season was the 4-1 win away at Manchester United. If it had won us the league then fine, but it never, it just highlighted the obvious and many deficiencies in the United squad. I feared Ferguson would come tumbling back to earth, along with his "best squad ever" and significantly improve the midfield during the summer. However, United picked themselves back up and finished the season strongly and I thought we had got away with it, that Ferguson would more or less start next season with the squad he has.
Barcelona, have just ruined the chance of this happening. Whilst we gave United a bigger tonking than Barcelona, the game last night was the most one-sided final I have ever seen. It was, quite simply, men against boys, it far surpassed our performance against them. It has also brought the truth back to the front of everybody's mind and highlighted the need for Ferguson to dramatically improve his midfield squad this Summer.
United have faced one tricky tie in Europe in two years, outside of the finals, playing Barcelona in the semi final last year. Arsenal are not at their best at the moment, they are, understandably, in transition. But even in that semi-final against Barca, they faced a side torn apart with in-fighting and a decrease in the team spirit that they had the previous two seasons and which has returned this season.
Domestically, there are certain clubs who don't want to see United lose. David Moyes took an Everton team to Old Trafford and refused to play, the Wigan chairman actually said before their recent tie against United "it would be a shame if we beat United" and several other teams and managers seem scared to compete or feel that they are part of the United camp if they don't compete. Fat Sam, Steve Bruce etc...
What this means is that Ferguson and United reached a stage where they actually thought they were invincible. Ferguson's comments about United being the first club to retain the top European prize showed arrogance to the teams who have done it already such as Liverpool, Real Madrid, Benfica and Nottingham Forest, but it also showed that he thinks he can brain wash more than just a few of his pet poodles managing in the Premier League and several sycophantic commentators who can't see past United.
But the foreign managers don't buy into it and the ambitious Premier League managers don't buy into it either. United are often there for the taking and, as Liverpool and Barca have proved, you can actually humiliate these over-hyped, deluded players pretty badly, even if you play without your first-choice full-backs and two or three outfield players who are struggling for fitness.
Steven, Liverpool
'We' Beats 'Me'
The discreet collective effort of a bunch of relatively ego-less (relatively) superstars beat the individual effort of 10 men and the world's biggest egotist.
The first 10 minutes clearly showed Ronaldo wanted the whole thing to be about him. He was shooting on sight with the mentality of securing his headline. He really played for himself. He was doing his usual falling over and getting nothing for it.
Meanwhile Messi, Eto, Henry are quietly going about pulling the MU defence all over the place and allowing their tip-tap midfield options for killer passes.
Great game, absolutely excellent referee, best team won.
Paul Chipperton, Toronto
PS. Yes I'm an Arsenal fan, and yes I'm pleased for Syvinho, but particularly pleased for Henry. Hleb?...whatever!
Is Rooney Too Nice?
Is Rooney too much a model professional?
When he shot to fame, banging in goals (esp. the Euros before breaking his foot), he was going to be the greatest ever. So what happened that he has been usurped by Ronaldo/Messi etc? Is it that he is professional, too willing to do what is good for the team according to the manager, rather than what he thinks is best for the team?
He plays on whatever wing he is asked to, when he (and all of us) know he should be up the middle, but Ronaldo wants that job, even though he is more useful out wide. Ronaldo, whinges and moans and gets his way and also the title of greatest player, that an up the front, through the middle Wayne Rooney should possess. Maybe he lacks the arrogance of greatness, Ronaldo has the over-arrogance of very goodness, and that seems to be the best we've got at the moment.
Last night Rooney tried and ran and chased back, but it is clear he is a centre-forward not a wing back. It's just he is so good he can and will play anywhere, maybe he needs to stand up a bit more and think for himself. Does he want to play up front? If so, he needs to get himself the job, and really that would be doing his best for the team. Every team he plays up front on is improved. Ronaldo does this why doesn't Rooney? He seems to enjoy Ronaldo's shadow.
True greatest stands up and takes charge, Rooney seems to be too busy play for the team to ever be best individual.
Enee
Easy Peasy Champions Leaguey
David Barnes pointed out that Barcelona wouldn't even have qualified for the European Cup in its proper format circa 1978, and thence asked how it can be easier to win the Champions League. I think I get what he's saying (very good teams would thus not be in the competition), but the syllogism is flawed. In fact it might even partially support the point all us old knackers were making: the CL is easier to get into, so teams like Barcelona get the chance to buy their golden raffle ticket. On top of that (and sorry about this, but I have lots of time on my hands), this year with their results against Shakhtar Donetsk (a 2-1 victory away but a 3-2 defeat at home), they'd have been knocked out earlier anyway. See?
So no retractions from me, at least. And I still think the group stages are rubbish.
Mind you he employed rapier logic to point out that there cannot have been a better team in Europe (ever) than Forest in 1980. Now, I never wrote that, but it's there in black and white on the internet so must be true.
Simon (even the nostalgia was better when I was a kid) H, NFFC
Some Fanmail For Mohamad
I'm sure I'm not the first, last, funniest, most apoplectic, eloquent, or bemused United fan to email you on this topic; however, Mohamad is talking out of his *rse.
For me, Fergie could get us relegated next year in a fit of senility and he'd still deserve to keep his job. As someone who was in the Stretford End for both of Steve Bruce's headers against Sheffield Wednesday in 1993, I can't thank him enough. United have gone from nearly there to perennial champions in his time as manager; simple as.
Fergie is a god; back in your box sir.
Tom Black
...This is Fergie that we're talking about, who despite losing to Liverpool TWICE in a season, still manages to equal 18 titles and a number of trophies along the way. This is Fergie who stuck to his tactics when his side went trophyless for three straight seasons before he won it three times in a row. This is Fergie, who is probably as hypocritical as anyone, has got it right 90% of the time. This is Fergie, who despite aging, has ultimately got the upper hand over his rivals over the years. And this is Fergie, who beat Barcelona last season.
You judge a man on his brain and age just because you refuse to accept that United were rightly outplayed by the better team last night? How dare you.
Julian
...I cannot believe some of these Man Utd supporters wanting Fergie to resign. Where would Utd be without this guy if they got rid of him 18 years ago when they called for him to be sacked. I am sure Utd would be playing Championship football now instead of playing in the most prestigous final in the world! Where the hell are Leeds and Newcastle Utd now. These teams had great managers (Robson, O'Leary) and treated them like **** now look where they are.
These supporters are not real supporters of football and clearly don't realise a good manager when they have one. Man Utd will regret the day he leaves as there will be a massive void to fill. I bet the glory days will be a thing of the past when he is gone. How long did it take for the glory day's to return when Busby went?
Fergie is the best manager this country has ever had and probably the best manager we will ever see for several generations to come as no club will ever give managers a real chance to make a difference. Ask a Newcastle fan if they were right to get rid of Robson or if the board were right to get rid of Sam without given the guy some time.
These fans are a bunch of plonkers!!
Jock
The Kinks To The Kooks
Parmjeet (Champions 09), the point of my very succinct e-mail was not a slight at Manchester United, who were clearly the best English team over the course of a season by a distance, and gave the team I follow a pasting in the semi.
It was not even really meant as a slight at Michael Carrick; after all it is not his fault he cost £16m and is so often over-rated. However, as Sarah Winterburn details in her blog, at a certain level he is out of depth. Please read her column for further information.
However you ask where does this leave Fabregas?
It leaves him at the end of a relatively poor season admittedly, however one blighted by injury and a manager who failed to add the necessary support to the position he plays.
For a large chunk of the season, he was played out of his best position, further excusing the above.
He was however, less than 12 months ago, an integral part of Euro Championship victory.
Though not a certain starter (nothing to sneer at as I think we all agree considering the competition), he outshone the wonderful Xavi and Iniesta in some of those games for his country.
He was superb in his first three Premiership seasons, and was the fulcrum of a side that nearly did for Barca three years ago in the CL (aged 19 ffs).
He is still only 22.
He is coveted by all the top clubs, including last nights Champions of Football¿, because he is an heir to the throne Xavi and Iniesta (being four years their junior).
In short, he is to Carrick what the Kinks are to the Kooks.
Mot (overly long I know, but I did big up a F365 columnist) Dublin
Medal Talk
I believe it's about time the FA, and by extension UEFA and FIFA, had another look at the rules regarding cup medals and players being cup-tied (I tried typing cup-tying and cup-tieing but neither looked right).
As a Man City player, Jo turned out for 20 minutes in Man City's third round FA Cup defeat by Forest. He was later loaned out to Everton for the rest of the season.
Because of his 20-minute cameo for City, the rules state he can't turn out for Everton for this year's tournament.
Compare this to Phil Jagielka, whom Everton fans recently voted him Player of the Year.
Jags played every minute of every round of the FA Cup, scoring the decider in the penalty shoot-out against Man U. Six days later he lands badly and ruptures his anterior cruciate ligament which rules him out of the final. As a result, Jags will have to watch the game from the stands and will not be eligible for the medal he richly deserves.
Why is it that 20 minutes of action effectively bars Jo's participation in five subsequent games (not including replays) whilst Jags' contribution in five whole games, including extra time, does not qualify him for a medal?
Am I the only one who sees the inconsistency in this?
Roy King (Everton for the cup) Miaa, ex-pat scouser, Stavanger, Norway
Firstly, well done Barcelona, absolutely flawless, the most skilful team in the world at the moment. Messi is not just the best player, he is the best player I have seen since Maradona for natural skill.
I thought Liverpool's worst result of the season was the 4-1 win away at Manchester United. If it had won us the league then fine, but it never, it just highlighted the obvious and many deficiencies in the United squad. I feared Ferguson would come tumbling back to earth, along with his "best squad ever" and significantly improve the midfield during the summer. However, United picked themselves back up and finished the season strongly and I thought we had got away with it, that Ferguson would more or less start next season with the squad he has.
Barcelona, have just ruined the chance of this happening. Whilst we gave United a bigger tonking than Barcelona, the game last night was the most one-sided final I have ever seen. It was, quite simply, men against boys, it far surpassed our performance against them. It has also brought the truth back to the front of everybody's mind and highlighted the need for Ferguson to dramatically improve his midfield squad this Summer.
United have faced one tricky tie in Europe in two years, outside of the finals, playing Barcelona in the semi final last year. Arsenal are not at their best at the moment, they are, understandably, in transition. But even in that semi-final against Barca, they faced a side torn apart with in-fighting and a decrease in the team spirit that they had the previous two seasons and which has returned this season.
Domestically, there are certain clubs who don't want to see United lose. David Moyes took an Everton team to Old Trafford and refused to play, the Wigan chairman actually said before their recent tie against United "it would be a shame if we beat United" and several other teams and managers seem scared to compete or feel that they are part of the United camp if they don't compete. Fat Sam, Steve Bruce etc...
What this means is that Ferguson and United reached a stage where they actually thought they were invincible. Ferguson's comments about United being the first club to retain the top European prize showed arrogance to the teams who have done it already such as Liverpool, Real Madrid, Benfica and Nottingham Forest, but it also showed that he thinks he can brain wash more than just a few of his pet poodles managing in the Premier League and several sycophantic commentators who can't see past United.
But the foreign managers don't buy into it and the ambitious Premier League managers don't buy into it either. United are often there for the taking and, as Liverpool and Barca have proved, you can actually humiliate these over-hyped, deluded players pretty badly, even if you play without your first-choice full-backs and two or three outfield players who are struggling for fitness.
Steven, Liverpool
'We' Beats 'Me'
The discreet collective effort of a bunch of relatively ego-less (relatively) superstars beat the individual effort of 10 men and the world's biggest egotist.
The first 10 minutes clearly showed Ronaldo wanted the whole thing to be about him. He was shooting on sight with the mentality of securing his headline. He really played for himself. He was doing his usual falling over and getting nothing for it.
Meanwhile Messi, Eto, Henry are quietly going about pulling the MU defence all over the place and allowing their tip-tap midfield options for killer passes.
Great game, absolutely excellent referee, best team won.
Paul Chipperton, Toronto
PS. Yes I'm an Arsenal fan, and yes I'm pleased for Syvinho, but particularly pleased for Henry. Hleb?...whatever!
Is Rooney Too Nice?
Is Rooney too much a model professional?
When he shot to fame, banging in goals (esp. the Euros before breaking his foot), he was going to be the greatest ever. So what happened that he has been usurped by Ronaldo/Messi etc? Is it that he is professional, too willing to do what is good for the team according to the manager, rather than what he thinks is best for the team?
He plays on whatever wing he is asked to, when he (and all of us) know he should be up the middle, but Ronaldo wants that job, even though he is more useful out wide. Ronaldo, whinges and moans and gets his way and also the title of greatest player, that an up the front, through the middle Wayne Rooney should possess. Maybe he lacks the arrogance of greatness, Ronaldo has the over-arrogance of very goodness, and that seems to be the best we've got at the moment.
Last night Rooney tried and ran and chased back, but it is clear he is a centre-forward not a wing back. It's just he is so good he can and will play anywhere, maybe he needs to stand up a bit more and think for himself. Does he want to play up front? If so, he needs to get himself the job, and really that would be doing his best for the team. Every team he plays up front on is improved. Ronaldo does this why doesn't Rooney? He seems to enjoy Ronaldo's shadow.
True greatest stands up and takes charge, Rooney seems to be too busy play for the team to ever be best individual.
Enee
Easy Peasy Champions Leaguey
David Barnes pointed out that Barcelona wouldn't even have qualified for the European Cup in its proper format circa 1978, and thence asked how it can be easier to win the Champions League. I think I get what he's saying (very good teams would thus not be in the competition), but the syllogism is flawed. In fact it might even partially support the point all us old knackers were making: the CL is easier to get into, so teams like Barcelona get the chance to buy their golden raffle ticket. On top of that (and sorry about this, but I have lots of time on my hands), this year with their results against Shakhtar Donetsk (a 2-1 victory away but a 3-2 defeat at home), they'd have been knocked out earlier anyway. See?
So no retractions from me, at least. And I still think the group stages are rubbish.
Mind you he employed rapier logic to point out that there cannot have been a better team in Europe (ever) than Forest in 1980. Now, I never wrote that, but it's there in black and white on the internet so must be true.
Simon (even the nostalgia was better when I was a kid) H, NFFC
Some Fanmail For Mohamad
I'm sure I'm not the first, last, funniest, most apoplectic, eloquent, or bemused United fan to email you on this topic; however, Mohamad is talking out of his *rse.
For me, Fergie could get us relegated next year in a fit of senility and he'd still deserve to keep his job. As someone who was in the Stretford End for both of Steve Bruce's headers against Sheffield Wednesday in 1993, I can't thank him enough. United have gone from nearly there to perennial champions in his time as manager; simple as.
Fergie is a god; back in your box sir.
Tom Black
...This is Fergie that we're talking about, who despite losing to Liverpool TWICE in a season, still manages to equal 18 titles and a number of trophies along the way. This is Fergie who stuck to his tactics when his side went trophyless for three straight seasons before he won it three times in a row. This is Fergie, who is probably as hypocritical as anyone, has got it right 90% of the time. This is Fergie, who despite aging, has ultimately got the upper hand over his rivals over the years. And this is Fergie, who beat Barcelona last season.
You judge a man on his brain and age just because you refuse to accept that United were rightly outplayed by the better team last night? How dare you.
Julian
...I cannot believe some of these Man Utd supporters wanting Fergie to resign. Where would Utd be without this guy if they got rid of him 18 years ago when they called for him to be sacked. I am sure Utd would be playing Championship football now instead of playing in the most prestigous final in the world! Where the hell are Leeds and Newcastle Utd now. These teams had great managers (Robson, O'Leary) and treated them like **** now look where they are.
These supporters are not real supporters of football and clearly don't realise a good manager when they have one. Man Utd will regret the day he leaves as there will be a massive void to fill. I bet the glory days will be a thing of the past when he is gone. How long did it take for the glory day's to return when Busby went?
Fergie is the best manager this country has ever had and probably the best manager we will ever see for several generations to come as no club will ever give managers a real chance to make a difference. Ask a Newcastle fan if they were right to get rid of Robson or if the board were right to get rid of Sam without given the guy some time.
These fans are a bunch of plonkers!!
Jock
The Kinks To The Kooks
Parmjeet (Champions 09), the point of my very succinct e-mail was not a slight at Manchester United, who were clearly the best English team over the course of a season by a distance, and gave the team I follow a pasting in the semi.
It was not even really meant as a slight at Michael Carrick; after all it is not his fault he cost £16m and is so often over-rated. However, as Sarah Winterburn details in her blog, at a certain level he is out of depth. Please read her column for further information.
However you ask where does this leave Fabregas?
It leaves him at the end of a relatively poor season admittedly, however one blighted by injury and a manager who failed to add the necessary support to the position he plays.
For a large chunk of the season, he was played out of his best position, further excusing the above.
He was however, less than 12 months ago, an integral part of Euro Championship victory.
Though not a certain starter (nothing to sneer at as I think we all agree considering the competition), he outshone the wonderful Xavi and Iniesta in some of those games for his country.
He was superb in his first three Premiership seasons, and was the fulcrum of a side that nearly did for Barca three years ago in the CL (aged 19 ffs).
He is still only 22.
He is coveted by all the top clubs, including last nights Champions of Football¿, because he is an heir to the throne Xavi and Iniesta (being four years their junior).
In short, he is to Carrick what the Kinks are to the Kooks.
Mot (overly long I know, but I did big up a F365 columnist) Dublin
Medal Talk
I believe it's about time the FA, and by extension UEFA and FIFA, had another look at the rules regarding cup medals and players being cup-tied (I tried typing cup-tying and cup-tieing but neither looked right).
As a Man City player, Jo turned out for 20 minutes in Man City's third round FA Cup defeat by Forest. He was later loaned out to Everton for the rest of the season.
Because of his 20-minute cameo for City, the rules state he can't turn out for Everton for this year's tournament.
Compare this to Phil Jagielka, whom Everton fans recently voted him Player of the Year.
Jags played every minute of every round of the FA Cup, scoring the decider in the penalty shoot-out against Man U. Six days later he lands badly and ruptures his anterior cruciate ligament which rules him out of the final. As a result, Jags will have to watch the game from the stands and will not be eligible for the medal he richly deserves.
Why is it that 20 minutes of action effectively bars Jo's participation in five subsequent games (not including replays) whilst Jags' contribution in five whole games, including extra time, does not qualify him for a medal?
Am I the only one who sees the inconsistency in this?
Roy King (Everton for the cup) Miaa, ex-pat scouser, Stavanger, Norway
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