Sir Alex: Now we'll go for 19

[Paul Marin]

And Englan' is leading the charge in 'stamping out racism'............>>>>

Funny you should bring that up. I am in London at the moment and they had a TV show just on about English racism in football. They have come a long way, but still have a looooooooooong way to go. Black players are still apparently complaining at the lower levels.

Anyway, they referenced this match between Manu and WBA where Cunningham and Regis (two WBA black players) destroyed Manu back in 1978.

Go to minute 6:00 and hear the WBA manager reference the man of the match having to be "one of the two coloured players". They said that no manager who wants to keep his job could ever make a statement like that today (except for maybe ferguson - he is an untouchable, it says so in the FA Referees Guide and FA Rule book )

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XTAMsgAdsII

[Chez]

HL - those of us who are old enough to remember the British Sit Com "Love thy Neighbour" from the early 70's will remember Eddie Booth, the white racist living next door to the West Indian couple. Eddie was a Manure supporter. I think from way back then I associated bigotry (and every thing wrong) with Manure because of Eddie. Little did I know how bad it was until I actually went to OT a few years ago, so it is no surprise to me that they had a confederate flag in their ranks, none at all.

Now I hardly ever post on this board. I post on the "other" site but I had to reply to this absolute nonsense because it is nothing but bitter fanatical hatred disguised as insight.

You are correct, the character in the show Love They Neighbour was a Manchester United supporter. I can see that use of the phrase ManUre highlight your level of reasoning. And he was a bigot. Just like Alf Garnett, another TV bigot was a West Ham United supporter.

Obviously you are free to associate all the ills of the world with Manchester United as you see fit. Yes, even because a FICTIONAL character supported them.

However, you claim that a confederate flag in the crowd gives some form of credence to your association of bigotry with Manchester United is nonsense.

The confederate flag has no major history or being connected with bigotry or hatred in Britain.

The vast majority of Brits on seeing a confederate flag would think of Dukes of Hazzard, another TV programme.

Furthermore, bigotry where it exists at English football games is no worse at Old Trafford than at any other football ground in the country, your experience of 3 years not withstanding.

I know not winning for so long probably hurts and delusion has set in, but there is no need to slander Manchester United like that

[Paul Marin]

Chez, you are missing my point, are speaking crap and are WAY OVER THE TOP in your ridiculous allegations.

First of all - what insight!? I am giving an OPINION based on PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. Your position that I am positioning this as "bitter financial hatred" is beyond conjecture. Where in what I posted gives you such super human powers to read my mind?

Secondly, I was ELEVEN YEARS OLD when I saw Love thy Neighbour and had been supporting Liverpool for about a year!!! Whether right or wrong, evil or innocent, it still made an IMPRESSION ON A 11 YEAR OLD MIND who had decided to support Manu's rival team.

Third, anyone who has read my posts on this forum knows that I have NEVER ARGUED OR POSTURED AGAINST THE FACTS. Manure (yes, that's the equivalent of "Loserpool" in RBSC Forum banter) is the most successful EPL club of modern time and Ferguson the most winning coach of ALL TIME - I have said that REPEATEDLY.

Fourthly - where on earth did I claim that a confederate flag in the in the crowd gave any credence to my association of bigotry with Manure fans? Now THAT is nonsense. I say this as a LIVERPOOL SUPPORTER WHO REMEMBERED JOHN BARNES BEING THROWN BANANAS AT ANFIELD!!! My point was that it is NOT SURPRISING HAVING BEEN THERE (to OT) AND because I have a very good friend who lost 5 of his front teeth at OT less than 10 years ago as a Chelsea supporter being called every kind of racist term you could imagine while they were beating the crap out of him (he is a white Irishman by the way)...so forgive me if I have personal experiences that put the manure experience in a different light - does that mean there is no bigotry elsewhere in Britain? Don't be daft. I travel England once a month and I can tell you that this is FAR from the case. And not to put too fine a point on it, the English people are FAR MORE EDUCATED about the significance of the confederate flag than you give them credit for - far more!!

And lastly, not winning a trophy "for so long" NEVER EVER EVER HURTS A TRUE SUPPORTER OF ANY CLUB because a true supporter is RIDDLED with pride in his club. I will be a Liverpool fan if we get relegated to the Ryman League and will stay that way till I die, no matter if we NEVER WIN ANOTHER TROPHY EVER!! Most of the Manure "fans" (anywhere in the world, as was the case of most Liverpool "fans" in the 70's and 80's) are opportunistic supporters who supported the team ON TOP at the time. I would venture to guess that includes many on this board. I WAS LAUGHED AT THE DAY I TURNED UP TO SCHOOL TELLING PEOPLE LIVERPOOL WAS MY TEAM. As a young boy, that could have been enough for me to have "switched" allegiances, but most of them were all LEEDS supporters as they were on top at that time. So don't come and tell me about any bitterness crap, you don't know me and you have ZERO sense of my moral compass or convictions.

YNWA.

[Peter R]

"Hardly ever"? it's your first according to the counter: hyperbole already.

[Chez]

Look, you got called out on your nonsense so leave it at that.

You travel to England once a month.

I live in England and I am telling you, not asking you, that the confederate flag has no significant history of being used as a symbol of bigotry in the United Kingdom. I never said people don't know it has or is being used as such in parts of the USA.

Any person who knows Britain would know that. So there's no need to try and wave your "I know Britain" credentials at me. You'll lose.

Sorry to hear about your friend. That could happen anywhere in Britain or at any football ground.

Ironically, you say he is a Chelsea fan.

Well they really do have a far more established association with bigotry than most clubs. But that is neither here nor there.

Most of the Manure "fans" (anywhere in the world) as was the case of most Liverpool "fans" in the 70's and 80's) were opportunistic supporters who supported the team ON TOP at the time. I would venture to guess that includes many on this board.

No **************** Sherlock, all teams at the top get glory supporters. Liverpool still has many too.

Except there is one thing. Manchester United have been the best supported club in Britain for the last 50 years and I wasn't talking about glory supporters.

You just couldn't help yourself, could you?

I don't need to know you to see the bulls**t you write when I read it!

[Chez]

"Hardly ever"? it's your first according to the counter: hyperbole already.

Weirdly enough I actually have posted here a few years ago but my post count has gone to zero.

As you can see my join date is July 2006.

[Peter R]

Very well said Paul... I have no idea where some of the Manure fans believe that there is any acrimony being exhibited by any Liverpool supporter on this board because of placing second behind ManU. Go easy on Chez; he just rushed on this board and makes comments without even having a sense of the position that those regulars who can read with understanding would and should know.

I well remember you saying that it would be very very difficult if not impossible for Liverpool to overhaul ManU, given the strength of their squad and you have ALWAYS given Manure their props. There are some Manure fans on this board who are to revel in posting any and every article inimical to the "losers"... but that is their prerogative... the winners will and can always lord it over their rivals in the spirit of friendly (and unfriendly?) sport rivalry.

Hopefully, they will understand what we both know; at the end of the day that rivals can always sit down and drink a juice or two...we have our loyalties in sport and really at the end of the day it's just that; so to Lazie, Westman, Jangle, Sickko et al I say (which I have already said)...enjoy your day in the sun cause you never know when the sun will set on your squad.

[Chez]

Go easy on Chez; he just rushed on this board and makes comments without even having a sense of the position that those regulars who can read with understanding would and should know.

You'd be surprised to know how much I actually have read of the posts on this board. Not posting does not mean not having read what goes on on the forum.

As for telling him to go easy on me. Not necessary, bro, your not my keeper.

The man replies to a point about a confederate flag being waved by people at Old Trafford. He does not know who or why they are flying it.

He knows or should know that the confederate flag is NOT a flag flown by any group of bigots or racists of any significance in the UK.

He then uses his personal experiences of time at Old Trafford (unfortunate they may be) and introduces an actual irrelevance about a character he watched in the 1970s and then makes the comment

It is no surprise to me that they had a confederate flag in their ranks, none at all.

Typical fanboy talk

[Westman]

The term manure = or implies acrimony. It is in no way equal to Loserpool. We already had the discussion here that Arses was ok but Arseholes was not. I see manure in the same way. I think it would do us well to stop using that term here. It would be a step in the direction of toning things down but keeping the banter friendly.

For the record, as much as I am a Man U die hard, I have collected and worn, and will continue to wear, jerseys from Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and many other teams. I actually enjoy watching all of them play good football.

On a funny note, I remember telling others on this site that I asked a lady friend to get her sister to bring me an Arsenal jersey. I was so thrilled to receive it that I wore it immediately on a shopping trip to KMart. While I was there, shoppers thought it was KMart uniform and kept approaching me for help with various things. That joke was a hit here and even our Arsenal posters had a great laugh.

For the record, I like Mr Spock, er....Wenger, I adored Mr Ranieri, appreciated Mourinho, thought Big Phil was overhyped, I put up with and respect Fergie, but I don't care for Rafa's style. He needs to moderate if he is going to win and repeat that feat in the Prem. As much as I like the Liverpool team, I really think Rafa is being a bit silly by withholding concilliatory remarks to Fergie. I don't think the rest of the Prem and the managers will see that as being something good. Most of them dont like Fergie's antics but they put up with him because they see his achievements as being extraordinary.

Walk good.

[Peter R]

So Chez, you want to come and post on the board from an antagonistic point of view? I don't read the other forum; this is the ONLY one I read so I know nothing about you other than what you've you've just posted.

So I'm to believe you follow Paul M's posts and understand his point of view and perspective? Well, all I can say I hope you're not a JC grad cause if you are you would not be a credit to the English programme; in my days we knew how to read with comprehension.

Anyhow, welcome to POSTING on RBSC; hope you enjoy the ride.

[Paul Marin]

Chez, you are completely bogus. I may not LIVE in England but there is nothing that is "foreign" or unknown about England to me - including football. I have the luck to attend several prem games a year and I'm associated with a non-league team. So you "winning" on that front is as ridiculous as me saying to you that you are a UB40 and have no place in Jamaican football.

Secondly, YOU who live in England should know that MANY MANY SUPPORTERS come from around the world to watch prem games - including people from America. Have you not seen foreign flags in the stands before? Have you not seen a Jamaican flag in the stands before? It is you and your petty insinuations that have made a connection between the flag and me insinuating that it is being flown by brits? And furthermore, if you in your ignorance want to convince yourself that brits don't know the significance of the confederate flag, then you may want to dust off your Nazi flag, which incidentally has the same colours as those of manure - that was a moment of brevity just in case you misinterpret me - again.

Lastly, your entire premise is based on the ABSURD assumption that my post is rooted in "bitter fanatical hatred disguised as insight." Can you tell me where that nugget of wisdom comes from? Your entire post wreaks of the bitterness that you criticise me of, which is the irony in all of this. Your language is far more abusive and far more debasing. Try again, my Manc friend (oh oh - here we go again - this is the part where you claim that you are not a manc but really a Leyton Orient man - go ahead, make my day).

YNWA.

[Peter R]

Mine says 1993! the site wasn't in existence yet, so I don't really watch that but I take your word for it...I do have a recollection of a "Chez"; maybe you were put to zero when the site format changed...

[Paul Marin]

...maybe you were put to zero when the site format changed...

I think he was put at Zero for another reason - oh geeze...ah wah mek mi seh dat? No mine Chez...a joke mi a mek.

[Peter R]

How yuh stay suh...yuh jus reach on an a tell man seh wha dem a write a bulls**t, oh my! if you are an avid reader of this board you would know that while many here disagree on many things we don't go so low...at least the regulars who disagree don't; it's not the done thing.

Chez, yuh should just go down to the local, drink two juice and enjoy yuh side victory. Try to re think how to behave when yuh in respectable company.