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Why was John Barnes so successful as a player!?

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  • Why was John Barnes so successful as a player!?

    Massive, this is a discussion/conversation that I would love the massive to have without the almshouse arguments, and maybe some great points will come from it..."Why was John Barnes so much more successful as a player than other Jamaican players past and present?"

    Let's revisit the past for a second. Barnes is now 44y.o. and left St. Georges College to go to England at about 12y.o. which puts it at 32 years ago, so we are talking 1976 in about first or second form. This means that he probably was playing U-13 Pepsi Cup at the time showing lots of skills and promise like almost any other skillful youth playing in the same competition...maybe he stood out, maybe not! Therefore, if he had continued in school and not migrated, he most likely would have played Manning Cup between 1979 and 1981, maybe until 82-83 if he repeated or went to sixth form. This means he would have still been 18 or 19 years old, playing on those wicked Georges teams of 80,81,82 and 83 along side players like Chin, Skitto, Sinco, LittleJohn, Prendy, Price, Chicken, the Ziadies and Forbes...just maybe, and maybe I would have seen him play live.

    Now all those players I named including numerous others across the Island were just as gifted but never gone on to make the big time like Barnes. Remember, all this before Jamaica even came close to qualifying for a World Cup or had a decent league. What is that thing that made Barnes, and none of those players into household names beyond our shores? Was it the opportunity? Was it leaving at the right time before he was spoilt by different influences? Was it leaving with raw talent and nurtured by professionals in England? Was it a mind set or was he just driven? Perhaps a combination of many different factors. Well what ever it is I would like to find out, and Johnny will be in the perfect place to shed some light on that Thing that made him so great! Who knows, maybe he will dig into our football mines and un-earth that player or players that we've longed for ever since we watched him playing for Liverpool and England. Whatever it is, there is something that happen to our Football and players after age 15 that has an adverse effect on their development. What do you think massive, what is that thing?

  • #2
    Fundamentals. Take the ball down the wing and cross it. Simple football. We however are enamoured with Brasil so everyting we do has to be down the middle of the field where we inevitably lose the ball

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Sensi View Post
      Massive, this is a discussion/conversation that I would love the massive to have without the almshouse arguments, and maybe some great points will come from it..."Why was John Barnes so much more successful as a player than other Jamaican players past and present?"

      Let's revisit the past for a second. Barnes is now 44y.o. and left St. Georges College to go to England at about 12y.o. which puts it at 32 years ago, so we are talking 1976 in about first or second form. This means that he probably was playing U-13 Pepsi Cup at the time showing lots of skills and promise like almost any other skillful youth playing in the same competition...maybe he stood out, maybe not! Therefore, if he had continued in school and not migrated, he most likely would have played Manning Cup between 1979 and 1981, maybe until 82-83 if he repeated or went to sixth form. This means he would have still been 18 or 19 years old, playing on those wicked Georges teams of 80,81,82 and 83 along side players like Chin, Skitto, Sinco, LittleJohn, Prendy, Price, Chicken, the Ziadies and Forbes...just maybe, and maybe I would have seen him play live.

      Now all those players I named including numerous others across the Island were just as gifted but never gone on to make the big time like Barnes. Remember, all this before Jamaica even came close to qualifying for a World Cup or had a decent league. What is that thing that made Barnes, and none of those players into household names beyond our shores? Was it the opportunity? Was it leaving at the right time before he was spoilt by different influences? Was it leaving with raw talent and nurtured by professionals in England? Was it a mind set or was he just driven? Perhaps a combination of many different factors. Well what ever it is I would like to find out, and Johnny will be in the perfect place to shed some light on that Thing that made him so great! Who knows, maybe he will dig into our football mines and un-earth that player or players that we've longed for ever since we watched him playing for Liverpool and England. Whatever it is, there is something that happen to our Football and players after age 15 that has an adverse effect on their development. What do you think massive, what is that thing?
      You left out the most lethal of them all..Richard "buddyhead" Strachan..
      Last edited by Twan; September 22, 2008, 04:28 PM.
      Sunday, August 28th, 2011. We will never forget !!

      Comment


      • #4
        yuh saw barnes goal against brasil at the maracanas....that was a mannng cup dribble right there...

        Infidelity does not consist in believing, or in disbelieving; it consists in professing to believe what he does not believe. Thomas Paine

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Gamma View Post
          yuh saw barnes goal against brasil at the maracanas....that was a mannng cup dribble right there...
          yuh mean a Winchester Park dribble..
          Sunday, August 28th, 2011. We will never forget !!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Sensi View Post
            Massive, this is a discussion/conversation that I would love the massive to have without the almshouse arguments, and maybe some great points will come from it..."Why was John Barnes so much more successful as a player than other Jamaican players past and present?"

            Let's revisit the past for a second. Barnes is now 44y.o. and left St. Georges College to go to England at about 12y.o. which puts it at 32 years ago, so we are talking 1976 in about first or second form. This means that he probably was playing U-13 Pepsi Cup at the time showing lots of skills and promise like almost any other skillful youth playing in the same competition...maybe he stood out, maybe not! Therefore, if he had continued in school and not migrated, he most likely would have played Manning Cup between 1979 and 1981, maybe until 82-83 if he repeated or went to sixth form. This means he would have still been 18 or 19 years old, playing on those wicked Georges teams of 80,81,82 and 83 along side players like Chin, Skitto, Sinco, LittleJohn, Prendy, Price, Chicken, the Ziadies and Forbes...just maybe, and maybe I would have seen him play live.

            Now all those players I named including numerous others across the Island were just as gifted but never gone on to make the big time like Barnes. Remember, all this before Jamaica even came close to qualifying for a World Cup or had a decent league. What is that thing that made Barnes, and none of those players into household names beyond our shores? Was it the opportunity? Was it leaving at the right time before he was spoilt by different influences? Was it leaving with raw talent and nurtured by professionals in England? Was it a mind set or was he just driven? Perhaps a combination of many different factors. Well what ever it is I would like to find out, and Johnny will be in the perfect place to shed some light on that Thing that made him so great! Who knows, maybe he will dig into our football mines and un-earth that player or players that we've longed for ever since we watched him playing for Liverpool and England. Whatever it is, there is something that happen to our Football and players after age 15 that has an adverse effect on their development. What do you think massive, what is that thing?
            Great question,i will try to explain the difference growing up and playing football in England in comparison to Jamaica.I'll start with Jamaica.Most youth who play football probably started playing properly at under 13's then through there high school days up to Manning and Dacosta cup after you leave high school there is absolutely nothing to aim for because now your parents a mek you know seh you turn big man and you have to start looking to make a living so most of those gifted players reach a crossroads where they stop taking the game seriously because they cant earn a living.Now fi England. This country is total football, in every village,every corner no matter where you are there are junior football clubs from under 6's these kids are playing league football from that age there are always proffessional football clubs sniffing around to recruit the better kids into their Academies so any kid that seriously wants to be a proffessional footballer the opportunity is always there once they have got the ability and the right attitude.So the difference is the opportunity,John Barnes had the talent,the right attitude and the opportunity was there.When i look at the amount of natural talent we have in Jamaica it breaks my heart as a football person to see it go to waste,having a son that plays junior football gives me the chance to watch them every Sunday morning and i can honestly say we have got more naturally talented kids a yard.

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            • #7
              would you say that jamaica has an abundance of talent?

              Infidelity does not consist in believing, or in disbelieving; it consists in professing to believe what he does not believe. Thomas Paine

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Gamma View Post
                would you say that jamaica has an abundance of talent?
                Blood, talent galore only thing that is lacking is the proper system to nurture the talent.

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                • #9
                  would you say that "the proper system to nuture the talent" is the same or similar to "developing the talent"?

                  Infidelity does not consist in believing, or in disbelieving; it consists in professing to believe what he does not believe. Thomas Paine

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Gamma View Post
                    would you say that "the proper system to nuture the talent" is the same or similar to "developing the talent"?
                    Same thing

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                    • #11
                      Objection! He's leading the witness, your honour!


                      BLACK LIVES MATTER

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                      • #12
                        is cross exam not EIC....suh GWEH!!! and in any even dunny is a "hostile witness"

                        Infidelity does not consist in believing, or in disbelieving; it consists in professing to believe what he does not believe. Thomas Paine

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Sensi View Post
                          This means that he probably was playing U-13 Pepsi Cup at the time showing lots of skills and promise like almost any other skillful youth playing in the same competition...

                          What the hell is Pepsi Cup?!? What is wrong with you town people?


                          BLACK LIVES MATTER

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Mosiah View Post
                            What the hell is Pepsi Cup?!? What is wrong with you town people?
                            Are you serious ? you really dont know what Pespi Cup is ?

                            Its a Under 14 football for High Schools...
                            Colts is under 16..
                            Manning Cup is under 19..
                            Sunday, August 28th, 2011. We will never forget !!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              and remind us of the basis you used to come to your conclusion regarding john barnes and the talent he may have displayed in football while attending in high school in jamaica when compared to the other players who were then his contemporaries.

                              simply put, was he that much of a standout when compared to the rest of them, let's start with those on his team, STGC?

                              Infidelity does not consist in believing, or in disbelieving; it consists in professing to believe what he does not believe. Thomas Paine

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